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  1. #1
    Goldy
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    Monster's Insulin Primer!

    Monster's Insulin Primer!

    Ok, lets have a look at insulin.

    Its highly anabolic and non-androgenic, and in case some of you are in the dark
    (I'd like to think we're all clear on anabolic versus androgenic, but ya never
    know) I'll briefly touch on the subject before diving in... if youre ok on anabolic/androgenic
    concepts, skip to the INSULIN part...

    ANDROGENIC VERSUS ANABOLIC

    ANABOLIC is defined as "The process of constructive metabolism" or
    of building complex substances out of simple substances.

    The way your body processes protien, carbohydrates, and fat (all simple substances)
    and makes muscle (a complex substance) is ANABOLISM.

    ANDROGENIC is basically defined as pertaining to male sex characteristics.

    ANDROGENIC/ANABOLIC

    "Steroids" are actually called "Anabolic Androgenic Steroids."
    They accomplish "anabolism" through "anabolic" pathways,
    some being more androgenic (testosterone esters) and some less (winstrol, anavar,
    primobolan, ect...).

    Most often, with reduced androgenic properties comes reduced anabolic properties,
    but it isnt always cut and dry. If anyone is interested I'll go into it another
    time, but lets head toward the insulin topic.



    INSULIN: NonAndrogenic but Anabolic

    Insulin is NOT a sex hormone. It is not related in any way to testosterone,
    or to estrogen for that matter. It is a product of the pancreas as opposed to
    testosterone which is a product of the HPTA, pituitary, gonadal, leydig, mishmash
    of interconnected glands...



    WHY IS INSULIN ANABOLIC

    So why is insulin anabolic then? Insulin is a partitioning agent. A "shuttle"
    if you will.

    Picture insulin as a bus. Nutrients board the bus, and insulin pulls away and
    drops off the nutrients at the proper bus stop. That is basically what it does,
    and for all intents and purposes that is everything you need to know to understand
    how it works.

    So by insulin shuttling these nutrient where they need to go, it enables anabolism
    and is therefor anabolic!



    WHY NOT JUST TAKE CARBS TO RAISE INSULIN

    Well, the amount of carbs you would need to take in to increase natural insulin
    levels to the degree a 10 i.u. shot would would be far more dangerous than using
    insuiln (and using insulin is NOT that hard OR dangerous).

    Carbs at that level would eventually lead to diabetes and fat gains.

    If insulin is a bus taking nutrients where they need to go, then exogenous insulin
    is a bullet train! It can hold far more nutrients than a normal naturally produced
    burst of insulin can, and it works quicker. Exogenous insulin is the most efficient
    way to accomplish glycogen overcompensation, period.



    WHAT KIND DO I TAKE

    Im a major supporter of fast acting insulin. The faster the better!

    Currently he fastest acting insulin available is Humalog. It is active in 15
    minutes, peaks in 1 hour and clears the system around 2 hours.

    Next would be Humalin-R. It is active in about 30 minutes, peaks at the 2 hour
    mark, and clears the system at the 4 hour mark.

    "Biophasics" are mixtures of fast and slow acting insulins, but are
    not the best choice in my opinion, due to an active dose being in you throughout
    the day. The reason you dont want that will be covered in the "HOW DO I
    USE IT" section.

    There are also Humalin-L and Humalin-S, but they are long acting, and are no
    more use to me than the Biophasics. There are also porccine and bovine derived
    insulin, but I am against injecting animal derived substances.

    WHEN (AND HOW MUCH) TO USE

    Im going to assume we want to avoid any fat gains at all. Even bulking I dont
    like to gain any unneccesary fat, so Im going to disuss it from that stand point.

    The ultra conservative time to use insulin is post-workout. Most people who
    are concerned about fat dont go over 10 i.u. as a total dose.

    Some people us it on waking, before breakfast, since your body is in a basically
    carb depleted state. Its the kind of thng you have to try for yourslef, and
    if it works for you, do it. If you thnk youre gaining fat, stop. BUT! Dont start
    it at both times at once. Make sure you get your post workout dosage worked
    out and that you know it is not causing you any fat gains before you try pre-breakfast
    shots. That way you can take out all the guess work as to where any fat gains
    may come from.



    DISPELLING A FEW MYTHS

    There is a commoly held perception that you MUSt take in 10grams of carbs per
    I.U. of insulin, some radicals say 5 grams... well, theyre both wrong.

    I got curious about this when I discovered that my insulin dependant diabetic
    friend didnt even keep track of what she ate post injection. She would feel
    hypoglycemic after a shot and take a Glucose Tablet.

    A glucose tablet is only 5 grams of glucose (carbs)! So I started to think,
    "Hmmm, mabye everyone is off point on this?"

    After conducting a few experiments on myself, I found that you can go considerably
    lower in carbs than people previously believed.

    Now it doesnt make sense to go low in carbs, because that defies the purpose
    of using the insulin in the first place, but it does free us from having to
    use so much that there might be some "spill over" in carbs that cant
    be utilized. So it really makes us able to have more freedom in carbs choices
    and amounts.

    The "risk" in insulin use is not as risky as people believe. Any person
    with an ounce of sense can see the warning signs of a problem coming, and remedy
    the situation.

    HOW DO I DO IT

    If you look at the drug store, you can get these little pen cases that hold
    a loaded insulin syringe. They are great for our need, you load up the syringe,
    and put it in the case, and throw it in your bag/purse/whatever. After the workout,
    head to a bathroom stall and inject it under the skin! Pull up a little skin
    from the abdomen or upper thigh (anywhere will do, but these are easiest) and
    inject. Do not shoot into a muscle. This rushes the dose and makes it harder
    to predict when it will spike.

    So now you have 15 minutes to get some carbs (actually you have longer, since
    the initial hit of the dose is mild and easy to cope with, the spike is a little
    more harsh, but still nothing unbearable. If you use the carbs, you probobly
    wont notice the initial dose OR the spike.)

    (this is based on Humalog at 10 i.u.)

    I use a powder with a 20% simple/80% complex ratio (actually its 17% mono, 5%
    di, 7% tri, 5%tetra, and 66% penta-saccharides). I use about 60grams of carbs
    to the 10 i.u. of insulin.

    This gives me a nice solid stream of carbs to overcompensate my depleted muscles,
    but not so many that I risk fat accumulation from the excess.

    Now you are good to go till around 1 hour after the initial injection. At this
    1 hour mark, the majority of the dose hits your system. Now is the time to eat
    a good balanced (AND FAT FREE!) meal. The fat-free emphasis will be explained
    in the POTENTIAL PROBLEMS section. This balance meal of carbs and protien and
    little to know fat can be anything from a protien drink and a crab drink, to
    a low fat MRP, to some lean chicken and rice... your choice.

    After this meal, you dont need to pay anymore consideration to the insulin,
    it will gradually decrease and will be out of your system at the 2 hour mark.

    Till you get accustmed to the use of insulin, start low and slow. Start at 2
    i.u. then 5 i.u. then 7 i.u. then 10 i.u. That way you get a better understanding
    of any hypoglycemia you may encounter. Ive went as high as 35 i.u., just to
    try it, but at a certain point a higher dosage doesnt yield any better results
    (except fat!)

    POTENTIAL PROBLEMS

    Insulin is relativly safe. If you dont take in any carbs after using it, your
    body will give you PLENNTY of warning! Youll feel dizzy, tired, achey... hypoglycemic.
    What is happening is your body has no glycogen to use as fuel. Your muscles
    re depleted from working out, and often times youve tapped your liver for any
    remaining glycogen. The insulin does, searching for glycogen to use, takes the
    rest from your liver, and in the absence of carbs coming in to make more, it
    heads for the brain.

    Your brain uses glucose as its primary fuel source (a little fat, too.) Thats
    why you get dizzy and light headed, the same with during a ketogenic diet...
    low glucose equals light headedness.

    So if you forget about the carbs, youll get a warning from yuor body, and you
    can get your ass in gear and get some carbs in you.

    If you get to the point where youre nauseated, just drink some sugary beverage
    and get some carbs in you quickly. Youre still a long long way from any major
    danger, but dont mess around.

    "Fat Free" I said earlier about the 1 hour mark meal. During the 2
    hours of the dosage duration, you should avoid fat like it is the plauge! Insulins
    partitioning properties are as effective at sending fat to the fat stores as
    it is carbs and protien to muscles!

    So till the dose is clear of your system, NO FAT! (Thats another reason why
    I advocate the fastest acting insulin you can get.)



    Well, I cant think of anything else off hand that needs to be said, but if I
    missed anything, just ask. I may have taken somethng for granted and figured
    everyone would know or assume on their own...

  2. #2
    Senior Member H 3 L L S M A N's Avatar
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    Re: Monster's Insulin Primer!

    Very nice info, liked the idea on using insulin but was scared away from it, still will not use it until later and research it more, but I archived this for my own personal reference thanks.

  3. #3
    Senior Member coltmc4545's Avatar
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    Re: Monster's Insulin Primer!

    It's obvious that using slin on cycle would be way more beneficial then using slin on its own but, would it still be beneficial or worth the risk using it while off? I've looked into slin use over gh just because of the cost difference and all the fake gh out there. Obviously 2 completely different compounds that will yield different results but they both have benefits to BB. I've just always been scared off with the risk of diabetes and diabetes running in one side of my family. Of course they're a bunch of lazy fat asses that eat fast food all the time but I know the risk is significantly higher with it running in my family so I didn't know if the benefits would out weigh the risk.

  4. #4
    Elite juuced's Avatar
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    Re: Monster's Insulin Primer!

    I just read an article in last months Flex magizine that pretty much said that taking insulin was a waist of time and money.

    They said that all you need is a good whey protien post work out to get the same benifits of anabolism. Adding the insulin gave no extra benefit over just the whey protien in the study.

    /shrug
    51, 6'2"tall, 240lb, +/- 20%BF current cycle = TRT 200mg/wk

  5. #5
    Traptheend AndroSport's Avatar
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    Re: Monster's Insulin Primer!

    good post... but where'd this guy go?

  6. #6
    Zeek
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    Re: Monster's Insulin Primer!

    I'm scared of Insulin, whn you know someone who kicked the bucket from it it tends to do that to you. Yeah sure he could have been more careful I guess, just killed the idea of it for me many years ago.

  7. #7
    Traptheend AndroSport's Avatar
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    Re: Monster's Insulin Primer!

    Originally Posted by Ezekiel View Post
    I'm scared of Insulin, whn you know someone who kicked the bucket from it it tends to do that to you. Yeah sure he could have been more careful I guess, just killed the idea of it for me many years ago.
    Uh oh... wonder if same happened to Goldy :/

    Im no pro on all the peptide stuff... how would it compare?

  8. #8
    Elite PillarofBalance's Avatar
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    Goldy was the original Admin for this site and is a very well respected brother and friend of mine. He took a hiatus from the board for employment reasons.

    Anyway... I keep reading more and more on insulin. I am planning a GH blast stacked with slin for the winter. Gonna be fun
    "Overzealous dosing" -Jin

    Rest in Peace Robot Lord. First round of Natty Boh is on me when I make it up there with you brother.

  9. #9
    Elite Shane1974's Avatar
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    Re: Monster's Insulin Primer!

    Originally Posted by juuced View Post
    I just read an article in last months Flex magizine that pretty much said that taking insulin was a waist of time and money.

    They said that all you need is a good whey protien post work out to get the same benifits of anabolism. Adding the insulin gave no extra benefit over just the whey protien in the study.

    /shrug
    I try not to pay attention to anything I read about gear if I read it in a magazine that makes money off of advertisements for BSN, Animal, and Cell-tech. Just sayin'.

  10. #10
    Zeek
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    Re: Monster's Insulin Primer!

    To say insulin does nothing more than protein would be to ignore the mass monsters created in the 90's from both gh, insulin and aas stacked together.

    it obviously works! but like with most things there could be a heavy price to pay for playing with it such as developing insulin resistance and becoming diabetic or worse.

    Yes it is effective and works!! risk vs reward is what you need to balance out in your head is all fellas.

  11. #11
    Traptheend AndroSport's Avatar
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    Re: Monster's Insulin Primer!

    Originally Posted by PillarofBalance View Post
    Goldy was the original Admin for this site and is a very well respected brother and friend of mine. He took a hiatus from the board for employment reasons.
    Good to hear... too bad he's not around to add to our stacked vet lineup... seems like a wise fellow.

    Originally Posted by PillarofBalance View Post
    Anyway... I keep reading more and more on insulin. I am planning a GH blast stacked with slin for the winter. Gonna be fun
    Looking forward to hearing about it... post us up when you get it rollin!

  12. #12
    Elite beasto's Avatar
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    Re: Monster's Insulin Primer!

    Originally Posted by PillarofBalance View Post
    Goldy was the original Admin for this site and is a very well respected brother and friend of mine. He took a hiatus from the board for employment reasons.

    Anyway... I keep reading more and more on insulin. I am planning a GH blast stacked with slin for the winter. Gonna be fun
    Keep us updated POB and let us know how it turns out. I've heard you only really need a low dose to reap the effects, and it's only when people start getting greedy and using more than it really gets is rep as "dangerous" and of course you have to know exactly what your doing and be dedicated.

  13. #13
    Zeek
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    Re: Monster's Insulin Primer!

    I was going to sit back a bit more on this topic not to ruffle feathers but you know what i care about you ppl!! and being the old shit that i am I've been living in gyms since the late 70's and when slin came into the scene really big in the 90's I was there watching too.

    Unless you really need to go for mass monster status/size there is no need for insulin!! You can get plenty big and what I mean by that is 260ish 8% type big. Without any slin!

    Yes it kills ppl who do not know what they are doing. If you know what you are doing chances are you will not die from it but!! the connection to diabetes is too much to be ignored!!! studies don;t happen on this because it is no designed or intended to be abused by us so info is lacking.

    My info are my eyes and ears and they tell me clearly that slin will increase your chance for beocming a type 2 diabetic usually. If I count the 20 buddies I knew that used ionsulin extensively and tell you that maybe 7-8 are typ[e 2 diabetics now, wat would you say? Coincidence? yeah maybe

    But damn guys if you don;t need to **** with slin simply don't!!

    that is my 2 cents plz carry on, I feel good that I said my piece

    Just for the record you can get pretty damn big on a gram of tren per week also, toss in some anadrol with a hefy 2 gram test dosage and the size will come if you eat and train. Doesn't mean it is the wise thing to do friends, just sayin

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    Traptheend AndroSport's Avatar
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    Re: Monster's Insulin Primer!

    Originally Posted by Ezekiel View Post
    I was going to sit back a bit more on this topic not to ruffle feathers but you know what i care about you ppl!! and being the old shit that i am I've been living in gyms since the late 70's and when slin came into the scene really big in the 90's I was there watching too.

    Unless you really need to go for mass monster status/size there is no need for insulin!! You can get plenty big and what I mean by that is 260ish 8% type big. Without any slin!

    Yes it kills ppl who do not know what they are doing. If you know what you are doing chances are you will not die from it but!! the connection to diabetes is too much to be ignored!!! studies don;t happen on this because it is no designed or intended to be abused by us so info is lacking.

    My info are my eyes and ears and they tell me clearly that slin will increase your chance for beocming a type 2 diabetic usually. If I count the 20 buddies I knew that used ionsulin extensively and tell you that maybe 7-8 are typ[e 2 diabetics now, wat would you say? Coincidence? yeah maybe

    But damn guys if you don;t need to **** with slin simply don't!!

    that is my 2 cents plz carry on, I feel good that I said my piece

    Just for the record you can get pretty damn big on a gram of tren per week also, toss in some anadrol with a hefy 2 gram test dosage and the size will come if you eat and train. Doesn't mean it is the wise thing to do friends, just sayin
    I agree with ya... Not something I'd mess with but it is a good post and always lookin to learn.

    What a sweetie though... All worried about us

    Got a PM comin your way on something wolfbro

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    Elite noobmuscle's Avatar
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    Re: Monster's Insulin Primer!

    Yeah, I have always been scared of the insulin myself. I feel like I have a long way to grow in other areas and ways first.

  16. #16
    Elite ken Sass's Avatar
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    Re: Monster's Insulin Primer!

    type 2 myself so my shit is high anyway

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    Senior Member SAD's Avatar
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    Re: Monster's Insulin Primer!

    POB, you still planning on a GH+slin blast this winter? If so, I'm down. Because of the difficulty of finding log, and the fact that it hits so hard and fast, I'll be using linR as I did the last two times I experimented with slin.

    I think I'll do something along the lines of 10iu postworkout on ME days only, so roughly 6-9 times per month. Not going to change up my GH dosing at all when I introduce slin. I'm currently at 3.3iu, pre-bed, except on ME days I go 10iu pre-bed. Will be bumping it up to 5iu, split morning and night, when I get my rips in. Still will be hitting 10iu on ME days.

    My goal? To add some pounds to all my lifts. Sure, weight will come with it, but that's not my goal, strength is. Also looking forward to the beneficial side effect of anti-inflammation, one of the best out there.
    Conquer yourself through wise experimentation.

  18. #18
    Elite Jada's Avatar
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    Re: Monster's Insulin Primer!

    Really awesome post, thank u for the knowledge.
    Eating ass is anabolic. .. Stick your tongue in and hold it there for 20 seconds! Wise words from
    TRODIZZLE

  19. #19
    Elite transcend2007's Avatar
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    Re: Monster's Insulin Primer!

    I want to understand a lot more about this topic.
    HRT for life!

  20. #20
    Senior Member graniteman's Avatar
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    Another good read, been on the fence because of possible sides, eased alot of concerns

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