Pro-Hormone help needed

[iFrost]

Hey everyone, so lately I've been doing a bit of research before I decided to jump on pro hormones. I've been using google, but I feel as if I should just ask people that are more experienced at this than I am lol. Anyways, I was looking to purchase 1-Andro from what I've heard that was pretty good... However, I don't want to sound like I know what I'm talking about lol. I'm currently 6" and I weigh about 190lbs. I've heard it was pretty good for size gains, which Is what I'm looking for. Another problem that I've ran into is finding a place that actually sells this shit. I've looked all over, and nothing seems trust worthy to me anymore.

 

[thomasbrava]

Aside from eating right, working out hard, resting enough - creatine and protein - are really all you need until you reach your natural limits. I am not telling you anything you do not know. I always here about people wanting to take AAS / prohormones because they want to grow and they can't - but alot of times it is their food intake. Even on AAS/prohormones you won't grow much unless you are eating right anyways. Food is the most anabolic thing you can take - the right kind at the right time.

I would stay away from prohormones personally - you never know for sure what is in them. LGD 4033 (SERM) seems to be a common topic and they say it can add 15 lbs of lean muscle in 6-8 weeks. I haven't spoken to anyone personally that has used it so I can't vouch for it. The prohormones that worked were banned. With "prohormones" you take the risk of your testosterone shutting down with unproven benefits and unknown risks. I would never tell anyone to use AAS but low dose AAS with ongoing protection and lab work is much safer to me than taking a prohormone or SERM like LGD 4033 that is unproven. That is just me.

 

[PillarofBalance]

I wouldn't bother with em

 

[iFrost]

I wouldn't bother with em

Appreciate both of your responses and opinions, means a lot. What are your opinions in test e? I've heard numerous amounts of good things that people say about this gains that come from this, and would like to hear both of your opinions.

 

[automatondan]

Im curious as to the basic overview of your current diet... Knowing more about the details of training history and diet practices will give us better info so we can advise you on a plan. But either way, like thomasbrava stated, the good PH (which were actually AAS) of old are now all outlawed. I personally dont trust any PH nowadays because the people making them are not looking out for the consumer, they are looking out for themselves. They know they will be shut down eventually, so they are not looking to "keep" customers... Plus, what these companies have to do now chemistry-wise to the chemical structure of each compound makes me cringe... Who knows what kind of internal damage they will cause....

 

[thomasbrava]

would it be your first time using a steroid. How much do you weigh - bodyfat % - what are your goals? If someone was doing their first cycle test E is all you need to gain some good size (aside from test prop to kickstart it). But then again I don't know enough about you - your training/diet, years training, goals to give you any advice.

 

[automatondan]

Appreciate both of your responses and opinions, means a lot. What are your opinions in test e? I've heard numerous amounts of good things that people say about this gains that come from this, and would like to hear both of your opinions.

Yes, this testosterone gives this gains and come from this.

 

[thomasbrava]

I am not telling you to use AAS especially given I don't know enough about you and that would be your decision - but AAS (the proven ones) have history and the benefits and risks are well documented. That is something you don't get with a prohormone or "research chemical". As automatondan said - these companies are looking to make money by tweaking chemical structures so they can maneuver around the legal boundaries for now - do you want your health based on that. I don't think I understand what LGD 4033 is made of and not sure if anyone does - that is scary that people are willing to ingest that for perceived benefits and unknown risks. Even LGD 4033 can shut you down and for what benefit.

 

[iFrost]

You fellas are right... definately going to stay away from those... appreciate all this help! But, test e is something that i'd like to jump on! Yes, this would be my first time using steroids. I'm currently 185 lbs, and i'm 6 foot exact. Last time I checked, I had about 12-13% bf. This was a few months back. I've been working out for 3 years now, and have noticed a good amount of gains but i'd like to pack on a lot more. My diet, it's pretty basic i'd say. I've been bulking through the winter season eating healthy on and off but large portions.

 

[thomasbrava]

Regardless of what you choose to do I would recommend that you get a full blood test to see where you are. Not just hormones but a full panel including lipids, liver etc. By taking that you might find that your testosterone level is high but so is your estrogen level and by just taking an AI alone, you might see a benefit. Also having this full blood work done will give you a benchmark if you ever do cycle to see if there is something wrong. The test can tell you if you are healthy enough for AAS in terms of liver, lipids, etc.

 

[thomasbrava]

Do you track your macronutrients? I would first find out how many calories you need to take in to be at a reasonable caloric surplus for lean gains and the right break down of protein, carbs and fats. Like I said food is the most anabolic thing you can take. I had complained in the past about crappy gains with all my effort until I tracked my macronutrients on a daily basis. I was shocked on how far I was off - no wonder my gains sucked. Once I started taking in the right amounts of food at the right times I saw gains - I take in protein with each meal, avoid mixing carbs and fats, only do carbs for breakfast, maybe lunch on training days and before and after my workout - other than that it is protein with good fats.

If you do decide on your own to try Test E - take advantage of it during the cycle - don't train just to get a pump as that will go away once the cycle is over. Use that time where the stars are aligned to train like a beast, push weight with the strength gains, eat big (right big) and then implement the right PCT and the right post cycle eating/training and you will keep most of the gains aside from the water gain. But don't do anything without getting the blood work done first.

 

[iFrost]

Do you track your macronutrients? I would first find out how many calories you need to take in to be at a reasonable caloric surplus for lean gains and the right break down of protein, carbs and fats. Like I said food is the most anabolic thing you can take. I had complained in the past about crappy gains with all my effort until I tracked my macronutrients on a daily basis. I was shocked on how far I was off - no wonder my gains sucked. Once I started taking in the right amounts of food at the right times I saw gains - I take in protein with each meal, avoid mixing carbs and fats, only do carbs for breakfast, maybe lunch on training days and before and after my workout - other than that it is protein with good fats.

If you do decide on your own to try Test E - take advantage of it during the cycle - don't train just to get a pump as that will go away once the cycle is over. Use that time where the stars are aligned to train like a beast, push weight with the strength gains, eat big (right big) and then implement the right PCT and the right post cycle eating/training and you will keep most of the gains aside from the water gain. But don't do anything without getting the blood work done first.

I do appreciate everything you've taken the time to write out for me! Could you possibly add me and we can PM each other back and fourth? I'd like some more information on this because I haven't been keeping track of my macro nutrients at all. I'd like some more tips and what not to help me out as of right now. Also, even if I wanted to take test e there's no way I could because i'm absolutely clueless as to whom I should buy it from lol. Online is nothing but trash unless you're buying off the deep web

 

[CardinalJacked]

I wouldn't recommend them, but I applaud you for coming here for advice.

My roommate in college took prohormones freshman year the very first day he ever picked up a weight. Between beginner gains and prohormone gains, there was quite an improvement. Summer hit, he didn't lift as much and got off the hormones, and lost everything he had. He's asked me about them about 5 times this year already, and I keep telling him the same thing. AAS is safer than bullshit designer prohormones, and then I break down each prohormone and explain each ingredient to him. Let alone, he didn't even think about AT LEAST taking milk thistle with it. But he has a higher gpa than me in college, so he think's he knows more on the subject. lol.

In the end, it's up to you. I wouldn't recommend tho.

 

[iFrost]

I wouldn't recommend them, but I applaud you for coming here for advice.

My roommate in college took prohormones freshman year the very first day he ever picked up a weight. Between beginner gains and prohormone gains, there was quite an improvement. Summer hit, he didn't lift as much and got off the hormones, and lost everything he had. He's asked me about them about 5 times this year already, and I keep telling him the same thing. AAS is safer than bullshit designer prohormones, and then I break down each prohormone and explain each ingredient to him. Let alone, he didn't even think about AT LEAST taking milk thistle with it. But he has a higher gpa than me in college, so he think's he knows more on the subject. lol.

In the end, it's up to you. I wouldn't recommend tho.

Haha appreciate your response bro, is there something else you guys would recomend that won't do as much harm to me and isn't as hard to find. I'd continue working out without but to be honest I just love to see the results.

 

[automatondan]

Haha appreciate your response bro, is there something else you guys would recomend that won't do as much harm to me and isn't as hard to find. I'd continue working out without but to be honest I just love to see the results.

Food. Honestly dude. Even if you get on something; if you are not eating the right amount of food/macros, you probably wont get much in the gains department... You need to figure out your macros and TDEE... Use the myfitnesspal app to track your macros. I almost guarantee you are not even close to your natural potential if you dont know how to diet properly. No, actually, I 100% guarantee that. This is a science and it is hands down, the most important part of growing in the gym.

 

[thomasbrava]

I agree with automatondan - food is the most anabolic thing you can take in. Like he said and I said - if you tracked your macronutrients, I guarantee you that you will find that you are not even close to taking in the caloric intake you need, the right protein/carb/fat intake of those calories. Try it for one day. I thought I was eating great - but gains sucked. I tried the calculator after I determined how much I want to gain and how much per week (to come up with my caloric intake). 1) i was mixing fats and carbs which is not optimal and 2) my protein/carb/fat intake varied from day to day. One day to high in carbs or protein the next day too low. What is great about tracking them during the day, you can see mid day where you need to catch up. So if I am low on my carb intake - I will make sure to increase it before and workout only. You hear people saying eat big to grow. That is partially right to an extent. Once you know your caloric intake to maintain you need to be in a surplus but not too much of a surplus or it will be fat.

FOOD, protein, creatine, good multi vit - add ons before and after work out are BCAA and glutamine. However, if you are taking in fast absorbing protein before and after your work-out those last two aren't critical. Just my view. The most important meals are those before and after your work out. After your work out your body is in an enhanced anabolic state for 30-60 minutes and can absorb nutrients moreso than any other time. After workout - fast absorbing protein and simple sugars. Juice and protein mix is my staple - if I am on the go, a bottle of chocolate milk gives you decent protein/simple carbs - not optimal but better than nothing. Then after your workout shake, have a meal an hour or two later - for me if its a heavy lifting day carbs and protein (no fat) - if its not a lifting day I would do protein / good fats.

If you trained hard - not overtrain - eat the right amount of calories in terms of amount and protein/carb/fat, I guarantee you that you will gain lean muscle if your caloric surplus isn't too much. Not overtraining and giving your body adequate recovery time is critical. Like they say you grow not when you are in the gym but via food and rest.

First get your blood work - at a minimum your testosterone, free testosterone, shbg, LH, etc. If you aren't ready for AAS - if your estrogen is high, just taking an AI (i.e. Aromasin) can really help you to get in a better hormonal state and you are not shutting your body down. If you could find something to lower SHBG that would be a positive as it would increase free test levels in combination with what the AI does. I really don't know of any supps that can trully do that - AAS like tbol can but then you are in the AAS world and you shouldn't take an oral with out a test foundation.

How old are you - if you are 40+ and your test is low, you could look into TRT where they put you on 150-200 mg of test c a week - people think you need to take in 600 mg+of testosterone to grow. At 200 mg you are getting more than double the amount of test that a natural man makes. With the right food intake, workouts, that would be all you need to get steady gains. Steady is good. However once you commit to TRT - you are committed for the most part.

Just some thoughts - but for your sake stay away from all those supplements that say "anabolic steriod" effect without the side effects. Not good. Either be natural or go with AAS assuming you reached your natural genetic max. Like I said and others said - AAS do have side effects but they are well known and there are proven ways to minimize the sides if done right - supps and dosage and type of AAS. If you ever get to that point, you can then look at the pros/cons of each - androgenic/anabolic ratio - and determine which ones you might want to look into.

 

[iFrost]

Food. Honestly dude. Even if you get on something; if you are not eating the right amount of food/macros, you probably wont get much in the gains department... You need to figure out your macros and TDEE... Use the myfitnesspal app to track your macros. I almost guarantee you are not even close to your natural potential if you dont know how to diet properly. No, actually, I 100% guarantee that. This is a science and it is hands down, the most important part of growing in the gym.

Once I get my 25 post count i'm going to PM you for some help!!

 

[iFrost]

Appreciate that response bro, and I've been eating lots of food, started counting my macros etc like the guy has previously said, but one question.. I know this is kinda not a question you ask in the public area like this but you don't have to tell me directly just give me a general idea or a hint... Lets say I'd like to jump on some gear for example Test e or pro-hormones... Where would I go about getting those...? Not saying I'll be buying any, but if things don't work out then I'm not going to lie to you and say I'm not going to buy any. If you don't want to say, I completely understand.

 

[iFrost]

I'll be taking this into consideration, you're right man. I'd message you, but unfortunately I don't meet the required post count. Where's this calculator located at? And my biggest problem is calculated the amount of shit in home cooked meals etc. That's why I get so unmotivated to count calories and that's when I just eat whatever the **** I want. I don't cook the meals, I've got someone who does it for me however, it's random and they don't do it for my sake lol. Just curious on that part.

 

[ToolSteel]

I'll be taking this into consideration, you're right man. I'd message you, but unfortunately I don't meet the required post count. Where's this calculator located at? And my biggest problem is calculated the amount of shit in home cooked meals etc. That's why I get so unmotivated to count calories and that's when I just eat whatever the **** I want. I don't cook the meals, I've got someone who does it for me however, it's random and they don't do it for my sake lol. Just curious on that part.

I hate counting calories too. But I don't mind eating the same or very similar things repeatedly.

You don't have to count cals if you're consistent. If you eat damn near the same thing every day, just watch the scale. If it's creeping up or staying the same, and you're trying to cut, knock portions down a hair. If it's dropping or staying the same and you're trying to bulk, bump portions up or add a meal/shake/anything.
Diet is only as difficult as you make it.


Granted, this is coming from someone who's never seen more than 4 abs at a time. So take it for what it's worth.