Who's taking BCAA's?

[BigSwolePump]

BCAAs have been, and always will be, a worthless supplement for people who have their shit together (good protein intake, not training fasted, using gatorade +whey/EAAs for long sessions).

On a side note, shout out to placebo. Still helping folks make gains as evidenced by this thread

I agree but you have to understand that the majority of folks don't have their diet in check. Even here, there are countless threads of folks subing meals with shakes. I have seen "macro" breakdowns where the protein/carb/fat intake doesn't come close to the calories that some folks are claiming to ingest.

In a perfect world, everyone would have a great diet that ensured that they consumed all of the proper nutrients. Until then, supplements have a place. I have no clue how many vitamins and minerals I consume through food but I can tell you what my multi-vitamin adds to it. What if someone doesn't eat red meat? Creatine powder can help to supplement this along with other supplements. BCAA's when you are running to the gym after work and you couldn't eat since lunch 5 hours ago.

Not everyone can make nutrition a priority and this where they "supplement" their diet. I think that some folks forget this when they are able to prioritize diet more than the average joe weightlifter.

 

[MrRippedZilla]

I agree but you have to understand that the majority of folks don't have their diet in check. Even here, there are countless threads of folks subing meals with shakes. I have seen "macro" breakdowns where the protein/carb/fat intake doesn't come close to the calories that some folks are claiming to ingest.

In a perfect world, everyone would have a great diet that ensured that they consumed all of the proper nutrients. Until then, supplements have a place. I have no clue how many vitamins and minerals I consume through food but I can tell you what my multi-vitamin adds to it. What if someone doesn't eat red meat? Creatine powder can help to supplement this along with other supplements. BCAA's when you are running to the gym after work and you couldn't eat since lunch 5 hours ago.

Not everyone can make nutrition a priority and this where they "supplement" their diet. I think that some folks forget this when they are able to prioritize diet more than the average joe weightlifter.

Your making a general point about supplements in general, I'm talking about BCAAs specifically - big ****ing difference.

I'm actually not in the mood to go back & forth on this so let me make this very clear:
BCAAs are inferior to whole, good, sources of protein.
BCAAs are inferior to protein powders.
BCAAs are inferior to EAAs.
BCAAs by themselves do NOTHING because we need the other AAs to be present to get any sort of bodycomp/performance benefit.
That means they have absolutely no use whatsoever and are therefore a worthless supplement aka a waste of money.

If you want to waste money on it for the flavor or whatever BS, fine - go ahead. In the meantime I'll continue to bash them relentlessly because they are a WORTHLESS supplement - newbie, average joe, elite bber doesn't change that fact.

 

[BigSwolePump]

Your making a general point about supplements in general, I'm talking about BCAAs specifically - big ****ing difference.
Hint: BCAAs are inferior to whole food, protein powders and EAAs.

Every supplement is inferior to whole food. Again we agree. My point is that it still has its place for some folks who cannot or do not get enough in their diets.

 

[MrRippedZilla]

Every supplement is inferior to whole food. Again we agree. My point is that it still has its place for some folks who cannot or do not get enough in their diets.

Read my edited post again. BCAAs are not just inferior to whole food. They are inferior to other supplements as well.

 

[DocDePanda187123]

I am curious as to where better $.40 per serving could be spent. Hell, at the very least, you have flavored your water.

Where your money is better spent? We'll start with a short list but can add on if need be:

ground beef, top sirloin, ribeye, porterhouse, ny steak, filet mingon, shicken titties, lobster, salmon, etc.

since the average price of BCAA supps is around $30-35 for a 30 serving tub, and they say typically mix one serving with 8oz water, it's closer to $1/serving of 8oz water, although I admit with some shopping around it can be found for cheaper. If you want flavored water, try adding MIO where 1-$3.50 bottle can make 8-24oz glasses of water flavored you get about $0.15/serving of 8oz water.

 

[DocDePanda187123]

I agree but you have to understand that the majority of folks don't have their diet in check. Even here, there are countless threads of folks subing meals with shakes. I have seen "macro" breakdowns where the protein/carb/fat intake doesn't come close to the calories that some folks are claiming to ingest.

In a perfect world, everyone would have a great diet that ensured that they consumed all of the proper nutrients. Until then, supplements have a place. I have no clue how many vitamins and minerals I consume through food but I can tell you what my multi-vitamin adds to it. What if someone doesn't eat red meat? Creatine powder can help to supplement this along with other supplements. BCAA's when you are running to the gym after work and you couldn't eat since lunch 5 hours ago.

Not everyone can make nutrition a priority and this where they "supplement" their diet. I think that some folks forget this when they are able to prioritize diet more than the average joe weightlifter.

In your example of someone who has to train after not eating for 5hrs....go home and eat after the gym. It's not a big deal. If you must take somethig than take a normal protein shake and get as much or more BCAAs as well as every other amino acid. You seem to neglect the fact that the body doesn't get 6/9 EAAs from BCAA.

 

[BigSwolePump]

Your making a general point about supplements in general, I'm talking about BCAAs specifically - big ****ing difference.

I'm actually not in the mood to go back & forth on this so let me make this very clear:
BCAAs are inferior to whole, good, sources of protein.
BCAAs are inferior to protein powders.
BCAAs are inferior to EAAs.
BCAAs by themselves do NOTHING because we need the other AAs to be present to get any sort of bodycomp/performance benefit.
That means they have absolutely no use whatsoever and are therefore a worthless supplement aka a waste of money.

If you want to waste money on it for the flavor or whatever BS, fine - go ahead. In the meantime I'll continue to bash them relentlessly because they are a WORTHLESS supplement - newbie, average joe, elite bber doesn't change that fact.

Unfortunately, that is false but as you said, I too am not in the mood to go back and forth either.

You can bash them if you choose too. That is why this is called a discussion board. I take no offense. While you bring a ton of info and knowledge to many post, your opinion is not the final say on what is and what is not worthless. In the end, our opinion is just that...our opinion.

Take some deep breaths bro. Don't let a post count on a forum take away from my experience. While I value your opinion, not everyone out there are sheep. Its ok for someone to have an opinion that doesn't correspond to your own.

 

[MrRippedZilla]

Unfortunately, that is false but as you said, I too am not in the mood to go back and forth either.

You can bash them if you choose too. That is why this is called a discussion board. I take no offense. While you bring a ton of info and knowledge to many post, your opinion is not the final say on what is and what is not worthless. In the end, our opinion is just that...our opinion.

Take some deep breaths bro. Don't let a post count on a forum take away from my experience. While I value your opinion, not everyone out there are sheep. Its ok for someone to have an opinion that doesn't correspond to your own.

Post evidence showing BCAAs, by themselves, to lead to a bodycomp/performance benefit - no acute nonsense. I'll wait.

 

[BigSwolePump]

Where your money is better spent? We'll start with a short list but can add on if need be:

ground beef, top sirloin, ribeye, porterhouse, ny steak, filet mingon, shicken titties, lobster, salmon, etc.

since the average price of BCAA supps is around $30-35 for a 30 serving tub, and they say typically mix one serving with 8oz water, it's closer to $1/serving of 8oz water, although I admit with some shopping around it can be found for cheaper. If you want flavored water, try adding MIO where 1-$3.50 bottle can make 8-24oz glasses of water flavored you get about $0.15/serving of 8oz water.

lol fair enough but it still isn't as cheap.

 

[BigSwolePump]

Post evidence showing BCAAs, by themselves, to lead to a bodycomp/performance benefit. I'll wait.

Post evidence that it doesn't. I am sure that we can both find a biased study. Ill do the same.

BTW I thought that you werent in the mood?

 

[BigSwolePump]

In your example of someone who has to train after not eating for 5hrs....go home and eat after the gym. It's not a big deal. If you must take somethig than take a normal protein shake and get as much or more BCAAs as well as every other amino acid. You seem to neglect the fact that the body can make BCAAs when it needs to but it can't make EAAs.

I agree that eating a meal is a better option. I think that the bigger problem is time. Going home to eat or make a shake is added time. Personally, I need to wait an hour or so before I can lift after a meal. By then, you can lose family time which isnt always an option. I do agree with you though.

 

[BigSwolePump]

Post evidence showing BCAAs, by themselves, to lead to a bodycomp/performance benefit - no acute nonsense. I'll wait.

Yawn: Here you go. While it was slight, this study did show increase in athletic performance. I am sure there are other studies that show differently. In the end we are left with experiences and opinions. I won't spend hours finding more. This took me 30 seconds.

Just to be clear. I am not being a smartass but you asked me to show it so I did.

Link for you: http://sportsci.org/jour/9902/ams.html

Please see the 2nd topic following the Glutamine heading

Branched Chained Amino Acids

Some researchers think that a fall in the plasma concentration of branched-chain amino acids (BCAAs) contributes to fatigue in endurance events (see BCAAsin Kreider's review for an explanation), but attempts to enhance endurance performance with BCAA supplementation have been inconclusive. Until now, that is. Eva Blomstrand presented results indicating a 3-4% enhancement in marathon performance following consumption of a sports drink (PRIPPS Energy-2) containing BCAAs. Blomstrand also showed evidence that cognitive ability at the conclusion of a 30-km cross-country run was improved or maintained following supplementation with the same drink. Suggestive but not strong evidence of long-term benefits of BCAA feeding on racehorses and rugby players was also presented.

 

[MrRippedZilla]

Post evidence that it doesn't. I am sure that we can both find a biased study. Ill do the same.
BTW I thought that you werent in the mood?

My mood changed when you decided to claim I was wrong. It didn't help that you decided to equate our opinions to be of equal value

2015 review pretty much repeating my "BCAAs are worthless" stand: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26388782
"Despite the popularity of BCAA supplements we find shockingly little evidence for their efficacy in promoting MPS or lean mass gains and would advise the use of intact proteins as opposed to a purified combination of BCAA that appear to antagonize each other in terms of transport both into circulation and likely in to the muscle."

Your turn

 

[DocDePanda187123]

lol fair enough but it still isn't as cheap.

What are you talking about? The MIO is like 1/7th of the price lol.

 

[DocDePanda187123]

I agree that eating a meal is a better option. I think that the bigger problem is time. Going home to eat or make a shake is added time. Personally, I need to wait an hour or so before I can lift after a meal. By then, you can lose family time which isnt always an option. I do agree with you though.

So you have time to mix BCAAs with water but not enough time to mix whey protein with water? Or even with milk?

 

[PillarofBalance]

In your example of someone who has to train after not eating for 5hrs....go home and eat after the gym. It's not a big deal. If you must take somethig than take a normal protein shake and get as much or more BCAAs as well as every other amino acid. You seem to neglect the fact that the body can make BCAAs when it needs to but it can't make EAAs.

Wouldn't work for me. I would go hypo almost every time attempting this. But if I added bcaa it would guarantee going hypo from the leucine

 

[ToolSteel]

My mood changed when you decided to claim I was wrong. It didn't help that you decided to equate our opinions to be of equal value

2015 review pretty much repeating my "BCAAs are worthless" stand: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/26388782
"Despite the popularity of BCAA supplements we find shockingly little evidence for their efficacy in promoting MPS or lean mass gains and would advise the use of intact proteins as opposed to a purified combination of BCAA that appear to antagonize each other in terms of transport both into circulation and likely in to the muscle."

Your turn

The hell has happened to you in the past couple months? You know we all value your information, but lately your opinion has been tainted with your bitter attitude. And it knocks the respect down a couple notches.

Being a veteran does not give you the right to talk down to someone simply for disagreeing with you. BSP has been very polite and respectful so far in this thread. Calm down a little.

 

[MrRippedZilla]

Yawn: Here you go. While it was slight, this study did show increase in athletic performance. I am sure there are other studies that show differently. In the end we are left with experiences and opinions. I won't spend hours finding more. This took me 30 seconds.

Just to be clear. I am not being a smartass but you asked me to show it so I did.

Link for you: http://sportsci.org/jour/9902/ams.html

Please see the 2nd topic following the Glutamine heading

Branched Chained Amino Acids

Some researchers think that a fall in the plasma concentration of branched-chain amino acids (BCAAs) contributes to fatigue in endurance events (see BCAAsin Kreider's review for an explanation), but attempts to enhance endurance performance with BCAA supplementation have been inconclusive. Until now, that is. Eva Blomstrand presented results indicating a 3-4% enhancement in marathon performance following consumption of a sports drink (PRIPPS Energy-2) containing BCAAs. Blomstrand also showed evidence that cognitive ability at the conclusion of a 30-km cross-country run was improved or maintained following supplementation with the same drink. Suggestive but not strong evidence of long-term benefits of BCAA feeding on racehorses and rugby players was also presented.

Dude, seriously, you don't even bother to read the link your referencing?
No reference to the paper that they're talking about but I knew about the endurance benefit anyway. It arises from the fact that BCAAs can reduce fatigue by competing for transport with Tryptophan. I thought I made it clear that I was talking about performance for gains (strength) rather than in general but fine.

Also note that this little back & forth is about BCAAs vs nothing. For whatever reason your just ignoring both mine & doc's points about whey protein and EAAs being superior forms of supplementation.

 

[DocDePanda187123]

Wouldn't work for me. I would go hypo almost every time attempting this. But if I added bcaa it would guarantee going hypo from the leucine

You have red hair so you don't count

 

[BigSwolePump]

So you have time to mix BCAAs with water but not enough time to mix whey protein with water? Or even with milk?

I was thinking in terms of adding them to my water that I would already be drinking while working out. Protein powder feels heavier on my stomach too.