Enanthate pinning thought experiment

[Send0]

Whoa! Used to be a guy named Pillar on this board who gifted us a great calculator once, but that url went off into the ether some time ago. When I click on your link, I see it's some guy acknowledging what I said about the extinct url and hosting the same calculator, "steroidcalc."

Not sure what you meant about "dirty," but the one you resuscitated is, imo, a little more user-friendly than mine. They both do the same thing, I haven't checked yet to see if they come up with the same numbers, but it will be fun to check.

Excellent! What I meant by "dirty" is that the calculator you linked looks like it has the potential to plot the same hormone with different esters on the same chart; which would have been really useful for the exercise I did here. I haven't actually tried to use that calculator you linked yet, maybe it's not as advanced as I think it looks.

I've reviewed the code for steroid plotter.com, and it's surprisingly pretty simple. I actually want to take that code and modify it so it includes more compounds, allows you to graph/overlay esters of the same hormone, and also allow you to add your own compound if one isn't listed. Maybe I'll do this over the weekend if I get bored.

Seems like a lot of over thinking going on here. I just wanted to add that I have left the country (18-21) days more then a dozen times on a modest cruise dose of Test E. (300mg)

Yeah one or two times is an experiment but a dozen times is proof to me that you can go much longer between injections then most people think your able too.

Never once did I feel like I had crashed my test and I experienced zero side effects. Also most of these trips I was doing high endurance physical activities.
I still had plenty of energy and felt great!

This is pretty good! You were gone long enough for Test to pretty much be out of your system. Any similar experience with other compounds, and if so how did your body react with long stints in between shots?

What I'm more curious about is if anyone has experimented with long esters, and if they actually felt better.. or simply felt the same. I'm pretty sure if there was benefit then someone in the BB community would've tried it by now, but I'm curious all the same to hear about it all the same.

 

[Send0]

Wish I could update the title of the thread. I am talking about esters, but I really meant for the ester to be in context of harsher compounds than test. Though I welcome any input and thoughts all the same, regardless of compound.

 

[Jin]

Wish I could update the title of the thread. I am talking about esters, but I really meant for the ester to be in context of harsher compounds than test. Though I welcome any input and thoughts all the same, regardless of compound.

What do you want the title changed to?

 

[DOOM]

Your question is still kind of confusing? The only other compounds besides Test that I’ve gone long durations in between injections are Deca and EQ.

Yes my body reacts and feels better on long ester test then say Test Prop. I prefer Npp too Deca esthetic wise. Deca gives a slightly puffier appearance and It also provides slightly better joint relief.

There are not really many more examples too compare as far as similar compounds that are different esters besides Tren. I get LESS actual side effects injecting Tren E twice a week vs injecting Tren ace every day.

Tren Ace and Superdrol are pretty much the most powerful steroids I have ever used. It’s not a surprise that these also cause the most side effects of any other two commonly used steroids.

I have pretty much tried every dosing protocol to try and mitigate side effects of Tren and Superdrol..What I have noticed is that using them both Less frequently at lower dosages is the only thing that helped. The more frequently you inject or consume them the harsher the side effects.

Superdrol and Tren Ace side effects don’t get worse if you miss a day or two. You actually start to feel better. They both begin too clear your body resulting in Less side effects You Dig?

 

[Send0]

What do you want the title changed to?

I'm not sure, and maybe it actually doesn't matter since I really am asking about ester as it relates to plasma level concentration stability and injection frequency. In my head it seems like it might be more relevant to harsher compounds and not so much for something like test; but this is just my head cannon.

I suppose the title is fine the way it is.

Your question is still kind of confusing? The only other compounds besides Test that I’ve gone long durations in between injections are Deca and EQ.

There are not really many more examples too compare as far as similar compounds that are different esters besides Tren. I get LESS actual side effects injecting Tren E twice a week vs injecting Tren ace every day.

I have pretty much tried every dosing protocol to try and mitigate side effects of Tren and Superdrol..What I have noticed is that using them both Less frequently at lower dosages is the only thing that helped. The more frequently you inject or consume them the harsher the side effects.

Superdrol and Tren Ace side effects don’t get worse if you miss a day or two. You actually start to feel better. They both begin too clear your body resulting in Less side effects You Dig?

Sorry about the confusion. I think you understand the original question I was asking, and it's my follow up replies that are causing confusion. You raise a valid point in comparing anecdotal experience with using Tren-e twice a week versus tren ace ED, and this was my experience as well. If stability was a genuine issue as it relates to sides, then in theory Tren-a ED should've been better for me than Tren-e.... but that wasn't my experience.

So I think you may have just put the nail in this coffin, perhaps ultra stable plasma concentrations don't play any significant role in sides a person experiences. Thanks!

 

[brock8282]

Tren e twice a week will have less sides then ace everyday because e will not have as high of peak blood concentrations as ace everyday. Also I believe ace everyday is still more unstable then enenthate twice a week(your math is wrong in the first posts calculations). Plus you get a few weeks of build up to acclimate to the drug as it builds up in your system. Now to make the comparison better, I’d try enenthate everyday VS twice a week.

Typically the guys who preach stable blood levels would never do it with a short ester as even with everyday injections, it’s still has pretty sizeable peaks and valleys, those looking for stable levels use long esters everyday.

 

[brock8282]

Also just to add, when looking at testosterone, studies have shown and common sense will tell you that everyday e/cyp injections will yield lower and more stable dht and estrogen levels (the two things testosterone convert too). And these two things are the culprit of negative side effects from testosterone. Now if you are fine side effect wise with 1or 2x per week sides from test cool, stick with that, but if you are more sensitive to sides and using lots of shit like AIS and acne treatments, maybe try everyday injections of long estered test.

 

[Send0]

Tren e twice a week will have less sides then ace everyday because e will not have as high of peak blood concentrations as ace everyday. Also I believe ace everyday is still more unstable then enenthate twice a week(your math is wrong in the first posts calculations). Plus you get a few weeks of build up to acclimate to the drug as it builds up in your system. Now to make the comparison better, I’d try enenthate everyday VS twice a week.

Typically the guys who preach stable blood levels would never do it with a short ester as even with everyday injections, it’s still has pretty sizeable peaks and valleys, those looking for stable levels use long esters everyday.

First post compared Tren-E injected ED, EOD, and 2x a week, and it also listed acetate at the very end for a reference since it's commonly pinned ED. I used steroidplotter.com to get the values in that post, but if you're referring to the difference between the E3.5D compared to the ED/EOD numbers, it's because I rounded the dosages on the ED/EOD and that resulted in them equaling 301mg/week.

With that said, it does appear that there is something wrong with how steroidplotter calculates this. Enan has about a 30% ester weight, so of 100mg Tren-e oil should equate to ~70mg of actual hormone. By the first half-life(4.5 days) 50%(35mg) of hormone should be used, and by second half-life(9 days) 75%(52.5mg) should be used. If I add up the 24 hour interval marks, then steroidplotter shows 34.73mg used in the first half-life, but the second half-life has a total of 56.63mg used. Since injection frequency tends to overlap half-lifes, this small error compounds quite a bit when calculated over a full cycle.

I'm hoping someone can help me identify the flaw with the formula that it is using since I've been wanting to make an improved version of it; no sense in carrying over a flaw if it can be helped. I've listed the formula that steroidplotter is using to determine the amount hormone released per day. The formula appears to be using Euhler's number and natural logarithms. I've modified the script that steroidplotter uses so that we can see the first and second half-lifes that I described above, and took a screenshot of the output.

steroidplotter formula = (e^i * ln(2)/half-life) * dose * hweight * ln(2)/half-life

glossary
e = Euhlers number (2.718281828459045)
i = interval (i.e. day 0, day 0.5, day 1, etc)
half-life = ester half-life (enan = 4.5)
dose = amount of hormone + ester
hweight = hormone weight percentage (i.e. tren enan = 1 - 0.3)

 

[DOOM]

Huh?

 

[rawdeal]

Send0, tell the truth, do you celebrate Pi Day every year?
Lol, for some reason I actually memorized the value of e, the natural number, out to 9 places once, but I never knew it was called Euhlers Number.
I was on my school's Mathlete team, however, and still remember the Pi Cheer ..........

"Cosine, Cosine!
Sine, Sine!
Three point 1, 4!
1, 5, 9!"

cheers

 

[Send0]

Send0, tell the truth, do you celebrate Pi Day every year?
Lol, for some reason I actually memorized the value of e, the natural number, out to 9 places once, but I never knew it was called Euhlers Number.
I was on my school's Mathlete team, however, and still remember the Pi Cheer ..........

"Cosine, Cosine!
Sine, Sine!
Three point 1, 4!
1, 5, 9!"

cheers

hah, I didn't even realize pi day was a thing. I am a math wanna-be. I'm decent at it, and can understand things put in front of me, I took some advanced math courses, but I rarely have a need to use that level of math in my occupation. So my current math skillset may appear deceptive in that last post. LOL

Dig up your old mathlete knowledge and figure out if the formula on steroidplotter is wrong, or if the way I'm calculating the remaining hormone per half-life cycle is wrong. :beaten:

 

[CJ]

Send0, tell the truth, do you celebrate Pi Day every year?
Lol, for some reason I actually memorized the value of e, the natural number, out to 9 places once, but I never knew it was called Euhlers Number.
I was on my school's Mathlete team, however, and still remember the Pi Cheer ..........

"Cosine, Cosine!
Sine, Sine!
Three point 1, 4!
1, 5, 9!"

cheers

Fukkin dork!!! :32 (18)::32 (18)::32 (18):

*secretly likes it

 

[creekrat]

Fukkin dork!!! :32 (18)::32 (18)::32 (18):

*secretly likes it

I’m just curious if they made him wear the skirt or not to be on the mathlete cheer squad

 

[rawdeal]

I’m just curious if they made him wear the skirt or not to be on the mathlete cheer squad

They don't make us wear skirts, smartass. I just do it cause it goes with my pink Chucks and complements the fullness of my pom-pom's.

 

[John Ziegler]

POB was an advocate of spikes in hormone levels vs constant levels. In other words, he thought less frequent injections and higher peaks was better.

in the perfect specimen thats a good deal.

& pob also said he can run over a gram of test without an ai.

you inject me with over 300 test no ai & im gunna be like pissin through a 29g slin pin

 

[Send0]

So I've been away for a while. I tend to stay away from all forums when I get hyper focused on lifting; it let's me focus on my own "game".

Starting in February, I felt like enough strength and form had returned to start a basic cycle of test-e @ 464mg per week.

1. I decided to try pinning enanthate daily. I brewed up a batch with a concentration of 282mg/ml, and injected .24ml using slin pins every day.
2. The concentration is weird because I miscalculated the amount of oil required for my recipe (meant to make 300mg/ml), but the point is I know my exact concentration and therefore know my dose per week is accurate.

I've posted my blood work from before I took any test-e (notice the naturally low T), and blood work results taken again at the end of week 3 of test-e.

1. I've felt really stable this entire time, no estrogenic related sides at all. I feel very alpha but calm, and also my body feels "clean" if that makes sense.
2. Another thing, which I wasn't expecting, is that I feel like my metabolism is in overdrive. Fat has been falling off me without cardio (though I've added it in this week for heart health purposes), and I am always warmish.
3. Regarding the metabolism/heat topic. This isn't an accurate description, but if anyone has done Tren... it feels like a mild version of being on Tren (amped metabolism, body heat)

I'm not sure about anyone else, but the numbers seem to defy the notion that more frequent injections on long esters will result in lower total/free T compared to injecting twice a week. To be honest even I didn't expect the number to be this high. Total T is almost 10x of my weekly dose (the number, not unit of measurement), and free t is about 4x more than the weekly test-e dose.

I'm interested to hear anyone's thoughts/ideas/opinions of these results. Both of the blood tests were taken at 8am in the morning. I take my injections around 9am, so I technically had not taken my test-e dose for the day when I had my 3 week labs/bloodwork done.

Pre-bloodwork results (natural, before starting test-e)


Post-bloodwork results (end of week 3 of test-e)

 

[Send0]

I thought about this some more, and it's also possible that these results are because my receptors are extremely fresh since I haven't taken any hormones in over 5 years (at least). If so then I would also theorize they would be sensitive to exogenous hormone and have a higher uptake compared to someone who has cycled within the last 18 months.

TLDR; it's possible that I could be experiencing something similar to newbie gains, but for lab work instead. I've been off hormones for well over 5 years prior to this. Its possible my receptors have re-sensitized to the point to where I'm similar to a newbie again. At least in the context of lab results.