Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 20 of 35
  1. #1
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    660
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 11 Times in 5 Posts

    Cashout Back Training Thread...

    This topic is brought to you by our resident sage and my friend PFM...thanks for the idea!

    Cashout Back Pic from 1/22/2013


    Back training, for me, has always been a very difficult endevor. I think the biggest reason that has been the case is that back is darn hard to see when you are training it. I know that sounds odd but it is true. I know I do much better training a muscle if I can see it respond as I work it. That is just not always the case with back.

    Beside that visibility issue, back is a huge muscle group that is comprise of so many smaller muscles. That compounds the confusion for many when they set out to work back.

    I was no different 27 years ago when I started bodybuilding. I really had no idea how to attack this huge and somewhat invisible body part.

    What I did learn very early on that has influenced my back train and subsequent back development is what I call...

    RULE #1 of Back Training - Weight is a Function of Form.
    I learned early on with back to lift for feel and not for weight. With back it is easy to sling weight around doing rows and pulldowns. I never really benefited from that type of training in terms of growing my back and eventually it will lead to injury. What I did find to be helpful was concentrating on the contraction, stretch and the form. My goal was, and still is, to finish a set and have that tight, cramppy pumped feeling in my lats. If I hit it right, the lats feel like they are just swollen and hanging under my armpits. It is a hard feeling to describe but you know what I'm talking about if you've felt it before.


    RULE #2 of Back Training - Extend the Set.
    Back is big. A lot of times with back, the little muscles used bis, forearms used in gripping and lower back used for support will fatigue and give out first. I learned to remove those muscles as the first point of failure. Lets face it, if you are doing heavy cable rows or lat pulldowns with some weight, your lower back and arms may fatigue from supporting your body or holding the weight before your lats are fully exhausted. To this end, I like to use drop sets. The support muscles might give way with 280 but they can still support 185 for another 6-8 reps so strip the weight and extend the set. I do this with lots of my movements - cable rows, lat pulldowns are favorites for this type of back work - quick and easy and back into the set with out much disruption. A lot of times, I'll do triple drop sets with these movements. Another type of technique that worked for me for extending the set was super setting or even giant setting back. I love this type of training and it accomplishes the same goal with back as drop setting - going beyond your normal support muscle limited work load.

    So those are my two Back Training Rules. I've followed that type of approach for atleast 20 years now and it his helped me develop my back to a respectable competitive level.

  2. #2
    Elite LeanHerm's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    6,426
    Thanks
    1,337
    Thanked 2,410 Times in 1,185 Posts

    Re: Cashout Back Training Thread...

    Awesome read cash. Nothing but great stuff from you.

    I'm the same way as far as weight. The only thing I lift heavy when doing back is deads. Other than that I do lower weight and try the best I can to have perfect form. I isolate the muscle.

  3. #3
    Elite DF's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    8,408
    Thanks
    5,001
    Thanked 3,361 Times in 1,803 Posts

    Re: Cashout Back Training Thread...

    Very good points Cashout. My bi's do fatigue often while doing back. I'm going to do as you suggest.

  4. #4
    Elite 63Vette's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    2,256
    Thanks
    6
    Thanked 28 Times in 12 Posts

    Re: Cashout Back Training Thread...

    Thank you for the excellent advice brother!

    Respect,
    Vette
    Hung like Einstein and Smart as a Mule.

  5. #5
    Elite Patriot1405's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    585
    Thanks
    1,281
    Thanked 241 Times in 129 Posts

    Cashout Back Training Thread...

    Excellent read Cashout!!! Smaller muscles always give out first. I also sometimes use hooks on those exercises, to take my grip and forearms out of the equation!

  6. #6
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    660
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 11 Times in 5 Posts

    Re: Cashout Back Training Thread...

    Originally Posted by Patriot1405 View Post
    Excellent read Cashout!!! Smaller muscles always give out first. I also sometimes use hooks on those exercises, to take my grip and forearms out of the equation!
    I use wrist straps myself on all my back training - as you noted its the back we are trying to train not the grip strength.

  7. #7
    Elite mistah187's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Location
    Hyrule
    Posts
    1,292
    Thanks
    119
    Thanked 251 Times in 168 Posts

    Re: Cashout Back Training Thread...

    Nice read. Def good information .
    Stay consistent!

  8. #8
    Elite grind4it's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    Location
    who cares
    Posts
    1,637
    Thanks
    589
    Thanked 307 Times in 196 Posts

    Re: Cashout Back Training Thread...

    Great advise. I wish the kids in my gym knew this. My joints hurt just watching them do lat Pulldowns and rows.

    A bodybuilder I have workedout with told me "if you want to grow your back you have to check your ego".

    Thanks Cashout that was a great read

  9. #9
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Posts
    1,021
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts

    Re: Cashout Back Training Thread...

    excellent thread as always...two simple tips easily taken for granted and overlooked..

  10. #10
    Elite AlphaD's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2012
    Posts
    8,117
    Thanks
    3,966
    Thanked 3,271 Times in 1,933 Posts

    Re: Cashout Back Training Thread...

    Thanks for the great read cashout!!! Those tips are something I will start to institute into my regimen. I also have always used a slow tempo/mind to muscle connection when training esp. for back.

  11. #11
    Elite PillarofBalance's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2012
    Posts
    20,494
    Thanks
    2,144
    Thanked 18,098 Times in 7,789 Posts

    Re: Cashout Back Training Thread...

    Great info Cashout...

    For me, my back didn't start to develop at all until I really came to understand the mind muscle connection. Once I could squeeze and target specific areas of my back, I was unstoppable.
    "Overzealous dosing" -Jin

    Rest in Peace Robot Lord. First round of Natty Boh is on me when I make it up there with you brother.

  12. #12
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Posts
    1,021
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 3 Times in 3 Posts

    Re: Cashout Back Training Thread...

    Originally Posted by PillarofBalance View Post
    Great info Cashout...

    For me, my back didn't start to develop at all until I really came to understand the mind muscle connection. Once I could squeeze and target specific areas of my back, I was unstoppable.
    I have a hard time with that as well and I think its largely because as Cashout said, we cant see behind us...Any tips from anyone on geting proper contraction depending on back exercise?

  13. #13
    Elite JAXNY's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    Posts
    1,889
    Thanks
    723
    Thanked 789 Times in 459 Posts

    Re: Cashout Back Training Thread...

    Originally Posted by Patriot1405 View Post
    Excellent read Cashout!!! Smaller muscles always give out first. I also sometimes use hooks on those exercises, to take my grip and forearms out of the equation!
    Same here, I always use wrist straps.
    Thanks for the thread Cash very good
    Info. Like you said form is key, and more
    Important then weight. A lot of guys either
    Forget that, ignore it or some just don't
    Even know it.
    I use drop sets and triple drop sets quit
    A bit in my training. Works very well,
    With great results.

  14. #14
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    660
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 11 Times in 5 Posts

    Re: Cashout Back Training Thread...

    So how do I currently incorporate these rules into back training? Glad you asked

    There are several different combinations for back that I've developed but this was today's session...

    Heavy Lat Pulldowns -
    Set 1) 280 X 13 reps dropped to 190 X 9 reps dropped to 120 X 9 reps
    Set 2) 280 X 10 reps dropped to 190 x 7 reps dropped to 120 by 6 reps
    Set 3) 280 X 10 reps dropped to 190 X 6 reps dropped to 120 X 6 reps

    Barbell Bent Rows
    Set 1) 275 X 14 reps dropped to 185 X 11 reps
    Set 2) 275 X 11 reps dropped to 185 X 9 reps
    Set 3) 275 X 10 reps dropped to 185 X 8 reps
    Note: The trick here is to sandwich the 25lbs plate between the 2 45lbs plates and have a rack to pick up and set down in so you can strip quickly.

    Deadlifts
    Set 1) 10 reps X 315
    Set 2) 10 reps X 315
    Set 3) 10 reps X 315

    There you go. That is one example of Back Rules in Action!

  15. #15
    Elite PFM's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    Motor City
    Posts
    2,869
    Thanks
    256
    Thanked 729 Times in 348 Posts

    Re: Cashout Back Training Thread...

    I made my best lat gains last year using the contraction principle. Recently I have fallen back into the old rut of weight over form. Thanks my friend for the advice, it's just what I needed to hear.

    Straps are something else I've been letting my ego get my there too. Straps and drop sets (even if my last set is with the yellow DB's).
    Thugs
    Don't
    Matter

  16. #16
    Elite Jada's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Posts
    5,310
    Thanks
    2,425
    Thanked 791 Times in 602 Posts

    Re: Cashout Back Training Thread...

    Thanks cash for the knowledge.
    Eating ass is anabolic. .. Stick your tongue in and hold it there for 20 seconds! Wise words from
    TRODIZZLE

  17. #17
    Elite gymrat827's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2011
    Location
    shy town
    Posts
    6,768
    Thanks
    201
    Thanked 1,805 Times in 1,268 Posts

    Re: Cashout Back Training Thread...

    i do a lot of the things you talked about here. Back is my strongest area, but i dont just move weight. I breakdown all the muscles with various movements.


    I dont stick to rows + pulldowns either.... my little baller gym has tons of back machines and again.... i concentrate on muscle breakdown.


    nice post

  18. #18
    Elite DarksideSix's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2012
    Location
    MI
    Posts
    1,665
    Thanks
    395
    Thanked 425 Times in 218 Posts

    Re: Cashout Back Training Thread...

    as always, great advice Cashout. much appreciated!

    Quick question, how do you feel abouta cambered grip (thumbs same side as fingers) while training these lifts?

    I'vefound that by gripping the bar like this, whether doing rovs or pulldowns, it helps my smaller muscles from fatiguing as much.
    "Whatever life throws at you, put it on the bar and press it"

  19. #19
    Elite Azog's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2012
    Posts
    2,968
    Thanks
    540
    Thanked 594 Times in 403 Posts

    Re: Cashout Back Training Thread...

    Great thread Cash. You really are inspiring to a lot of us. Time to catch up! No excuses.

  20. #20
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Jul 2012
    Posts
    660
    Thanks
    0
    Thanked 11 Times in 5 Posts

    Re: Cashout Back Training Thread...

    Originally Posted by DarksideSix View Post
    as always, great advice Cashout. much appreciated!

    Quick question, how do you feel abouta cambered grip (thumbs same side as fingers) while training these lifts?

    I'vefound that by gripping the bar like this, whether doing rovs or pulldowns, it helps my smaller muscles from fatiguing as much.
    I always use wrist wraps so I general use a straight over hand grip (thumbs and fingers on same side of the bar).

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Guess who's back? Back again? Dizzle's back! Tell a friend!
    By trodizzle in forum General Chat & Conversation
    Replies: 28
    Last Post: 09-04-2016, 01:22 PM
  2. The Cashout Leg Training Thread...
    By Cashout in forum Training and Workouts
    Replies: 39
    Last Post: 06-12-2013, 06:07 PM
  3. The Cashout Shoulder Training Thread
    By Cashout in forum Training and Workouts
    Replies: 20
    Last Post: 04-11-2013, 03:45 PM
  4. The Cashout Chest Training Thread...
    By Cashout in forum Training and Workouts
    Replies: 32
    Last Post: 02-04-2013, 03:25 PM
  5. The Cashout Training Philosophy
    By Cashout in forum Training and Workouts
    Replies: 35
    Last Post: 12-25-2012, 08:08 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •