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  1. #1
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    The Cashout Leg Training Thread...

    Since we had such engaging discussion with the back thread and I have nothing to do today, I figured I'd create a similar Leg Training thread. So, I am going to start by discussing the evolution of my Leg Training Philosophy.

    First some current pics of 27” inch quads on a 28.75 inch waist…

    Quads – standing relaxed unflexed


    Quads – side shot


    Quads – front flexed


    Beginning
    When I was 15 and started training quads, I did the very basic exercises for traditional straight sets. Simply, I used the same common method approach that so many used and still use for leg training. I did 3-4 sets of squats for 10 reps. Then, I move on to leg press for 3-4 more sets before wrapping up with leg extensions for 3-4 sets of higher reps to burn out. After which I hit a couple of sets of lying leg curls and stiff leg deadlifts. Wrapping the whole thing up with calf raises and seated calf.

    I did this for the first several of years of my training. The routine worked well and did produce results. However, after a few years, I began to notice that the progress had slowed down considerably even though I was pushing heavier and heavier weight. At one point I was clocking 4 sets of squats for 20 reps with 405, 15 reps with 495, and 2 sets of 10 reps with 585 wearing nothing more than a belt. From there I’d move on to leg press for sets of 10 reps with 32 plates on the press. Yes, you read that correctly – 32 plates on a leg press! In terms of squatting and pressing, I was pushing big weight but the actual work load was just not stimulating my quads into additional development. Additionally, I realized that with an increasing weight load, I was risking significant injury. So, as I analyzed what I was doing I decide something had to change because the risks were exceeding the returns.

    Rule #1 of Leg Training – Make lighter weight feel heavy to the legs.

    This rule was developed because during my leg work, my supporting muscles like lower back and shoulders were starting to become the limitations in my leg training. I still ahd “gas in the tank” to train legs but I actually couldn’t because my support muscles were unable to continue their role in the exercises. So, I decided to get radical and switch things around. Initially, I inverted my leg training routine. I started with leg extensions and leg curls fist in my leg training. Four sets of each to failure was just the ticket! Then I would squat and leg press. Boy that made a big difference. Initially, I cut my squat weight in half. After pre-exhusting with leg externisons and leg curls, I was squatting with a mere 315 for sets of 10-12 and and press 16 plates for sets of 10. Worked great - my quads were again driven to the brink during these sessions. So this pre-exhaust component became a staple of my leg training. Later, as I my legs continued to grow, I had to again revise the pre-exhaustion part of my leg training. For the past 10 years, I’ve exclusively use the pre-exhaustion part of leg training in conjunction with super and giant sets for legs. This really upped the work load up one more notch and significant contributed to even more productive leg session. Today’s routine looks like this…

    Leg Extension – 200 lbs X Max reps to failure supersetted with…
    Seated Leg Curl – 200 lbs X Max reps to failure supersetted with…
    Squats 405 X 10 reps.

    I do that cycle 4 times. Then I move on to calves.

    It takes about 45 minutes to complete that leg session.

    Rule #2 of Leg Training – You can’t over train legs

    This one is going to cause a lot of folks to cringe but I tell you that the legs can stand a heck of a lot more work than 99% of the guys in gyms across the country are tossing at them. Someone once told me, if a body part is still sore from the prior training session, don’t train it because it is not ready to be worked again. That might be true for some body parts but I don’t believe it for a second with legs. When I was building my wheels, I routinely trained them every three days and sometimes that meant hitting them 3X in a week depending on how my schedule worked out.
    I know if your legs are sore it hurts to work them. That is true. Muscle soreness notwithstanding, for 90% of the guys, leg training is not fun. For me it was the my favorite body part. Now add muscle soreness to leg training and 99% of guys have the perfect excuse to go to the gym and do some chest and arms, right. That will not get you massive wheels. If you want to look different then 99% of the guys in the gym you must train differently. Legs have to be worked beyond what you think they are capable of handling. It means you have to be willing to cross into a whole different world of training and put aside fear and pain and not accept being a guy with “average” legs because the vast majority of guys have barely average wheels.
    So there you have it – a couple of my basic philosophies on Leg Training.

    We can talks specifics – quads, hams, calves, tempo, reps, tools, whatever you guys want. Let’s open it up!

  2. #2
    Elite LeanHerm's Avatar
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    Re: The Cashout Leg Training Thread...

    Wow bro. Just wow is all in gonna say. Lol.

  3. #3
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    Re: The Cashout Leg Training Thread...

    Awesome wheels Cashout! Great advice.

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    Elite #TheMatrix's Avatar
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    Re: The Cashout Leg Training Thread...

    Boner.


    Great work. Motivation? Thats plenty. Time to focus on legs more.

  5. #5
    Elite 63Vette's Avatar
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    Re: The Cashout Leg Training Thread...

    Great advice Cash. I stumbled my way in to the exact same philosophy. I train more for physique than the typical bodybuilder but my leg routine morphed in to the exact same changes as yours so there must be something to it!

    Much Respect,
    Vette
    Hung like Einstein and Smart as a Mule.

  6. #6
    Elite mistah187's Avatar
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    Re: The Cashout Leg Training Thread...

    Not sure if it is meant to b but, when I read things like this it is just motivating. I love training legs. I was born with bean poles for legs, I mean no shape. I have killed my legs for a long time and have gotten some respectable legs now. No cashout wheels... But wheels none the less. Great read and keep them coming.
    Stay consistent!

  7. #7
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    Re: The Cashout Leg Training Thread...

    Not my intention to be "a motivational" figure. I am happy nonetheless if I have that impact. I just truly enjoy bodybuilding and it is something that I don't get to discuss on a daily basis with those physically around me so I have to turn to you guys.

    Originally Posted by mistah187 View Post
    Not sure if it is meant to b but, when I read things like this it is just motivating. I love training legs. I was born with bean poles for legs, I mean no shape. I have killed my legs for a long time and have gotten some respectable legs now. No cashout wheels... But wheels none the less. Great read and keep them coming.

  8. #8
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    Re: The Cashout Leg Training Thread...

    A couple of other thoughts....

    Knee Wraps - I don't use them. I tried them years ago and the problem I had was that they really stifled the pump in my legs. It made it very hard for me to feel the muscles and focus on the contractions. Additionally, my training now involves a lot of super and giant sets so wraps are just not an option.

    Depth on Squat - Some guys use the phrase "ATG." Well, in fact, I've never actually seen anyone touch their buttocks to the ground doing a squat unless they were falling. I use the phrase "till my hamstrings touch my calves." For me that puts the top of my quads parallel to the floor. I don't like to say "parallel" cause a lot of guys judge "parallel" by their hamstrings - I swear I have had guys look in the mirror and see that their hamstrings are parallel to the floor and call that a parallel depth squat. Big difference between parallel on the hamstrings and the top of the quads. That is why I say "till my hamstring touch my calves.

    Smith Machine Squats - I have done a lot of this and sometimes I still do - I know you'll say "heretic" and try to stone me but here me out. on days when I train by myself, I found that it was the best "safety" option when superstting/giant setting extensions and leg curls and squatting. I have never fallen with a bar on my back and I never will. That will only lead to an injury and in no way contribute to improving your physique. So once I started doing a lot of giant sets, the Smith Machine Squat became a safe way to push physical boundaries without a spotter.

    Reps - Historically, I never did anything less than 8 reps on a leg exercise. Doubles and Triples are not going to contribute to a bodybuilding physique. They will get you injured. Check your ego at the door if you want to build wheels like a BB. Today, it's nothing less than 10 reps and it has been that way for about the past 10 years. I also found very high rep straight sets beneficial as I was transitioning into super and giant sets for legs. That is one more subtle way to begin to work into this style of intense training and not initially overwhelm yourself.

    Last but not least, Throwing up - yes, I've had plenty of those session when I lost my cookies. Not proud of it because in the end all you have done is wasted a meal. But, if you train like I do it will happen to you until you condition your body to handle the CNS stress that this type of leg training puts on you. Don't let it distract you from pushing into that pain zone. Most guys fear it but to really really get into a whole different leg training level you have to condition your mind and body to move past it.

  9. #9
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    Re: The Cashout Leg Training Thread...

    Originally Posted by Cashout View Post
    Not my intention to be "a motivational" figure. I am happy nonetheless if I have that impact. I just truly enjoy bodybuilding and it is something that I don't get to discuss on a daily basis with those physically around me so I have to turn to you guys.
    Keep it coming then, because you can not get any more helpful or motivational. Thanks brother!

  10. #10
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    Re: The Cashout Leg Training Thread...

    i like days when cash has nothing else to do!!!! We all benefit..

  11. #11
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    Re: The Cashout Leg Training Thread...

    I recently incorporated pre-exuastion and instantly added size and shape. I'll be doing super-set sled or hacks and extensions next leg training day. Giant sets session after that. I've read over the years the trauma required and pretty much ignored by the muscle fibers in the legs is several times more then any muscle group: Period. With this confirmation I am throwing all my prior leg principles out the window.
    Often these ideas run wild in my head but I find my comfort zone once in the gym. Another remarkably clear and motivating thread by One Real Mother Focker.

    Thanks Cash!
    Thugs
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  12. #12
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    Re: The Cashout Leg Training Thread...

    nice post Mr. UnReal.


    continue on with chest, arms, etc etc

    these threads create tons of conversation

  13. #13
    Senior Moderator NbleSavage's Avatar
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    Re: The Cashout Leg Training Thread...

    Much respect, Cash and thanks for sharing! Care to layout your entire leg training cycle? (eg. days per week and alternate workouts) This thread is timely for me as I'm looking to mix-up my leg workout. Your "Giant Sets" approach might be just the ticket!

  14. #14
    Elite DarksideSix's Avatar
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    Re: The Cashout Leg Training Thread...

    I heard you talk briefly about something like this for legs on another site and I tried it for about weeks. super setted 3 sets of leg ext to failure with 20 rep squats. **** me running that was brutal, lost my lunch a fe times but i'll be damn if my legs didn't look the best they ever have. I was always more of a power/big lifter with legs, heavy squats and dead lifts but i finaly checked my ego and tried the high rep/super set thing and it's great stuff.

    Cheers!
    "Whatever life throws at you, put it on the bar and press it"

  15. #15
    Elite grind4it's Avatar
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    Re: The Cashout Leg Training Thread...

    Cashout, thank you very much for taking the time to share this information.

    Grind

  16. #16
    Elite JOMO's Avatar
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    Re: The Cashout Leg Training Thread...

    WHAT ARE YOU!?

    In all seriousness, thank you! Over the past month I have dropped weight significantly to "perfect" my form and exhaust the muscle more. Great advice as always. Also as said as above, lets get you a few more days off and get a cashout training manual going.
    "There are only two days in the year nothing can be done. One is called yesterday and the other is called tomorrow"

  17. #17
    Traptheend AndroSport's Avatar
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    Re: The Cashout Leg Training Thread...

    I am one of the guys who gets leg soreness so crippling that I feel i need a wheelchair lol... it gradually gets worse over the first 4-5 days and end up lasting about a week each time. I swear I sometimes i feel less mobile than my grandma who's 97. Doing some light leg work seems to help work out some of the soreness though.

    I think my legs are sore just from reading this thread though. Nice!

  18. #18
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    Re: The Cashout Leg Training Thread...

    Originally Posted by NbleSavage View Post
    Much respect, Cash and thanks for sharing! Care to layout your entire leg training cycle? (eg. days per week and alternate workouts) This thread is timely for me as I'm looking to mix-up my leg workout. Your "Giant Sets" approach might be just the ticket!
    The days per week actually varies based on how I feel. In the past when I was working to build mass, I'd hit legs in some weeks as many as three times. I remember many times training legs on Monday, Thursday, and again on Sunday only to train them one time on Thursday the following week. Other times, I'd go for long stretches where I'd hit legs twice a week on Tuesday and again on Friday.

    That was when I was working to build mass. For the past 10 years, I've only trained them once a week with the idea of 100% maintenance. I don't want to add anymore size to my legs whatsoever. So I train just enough to keep them where they are in the those pics I posted.

    As I wrote, the best growth for me came from intense super setting and giant setting with a "pre-exhuast" approach.

    All of those session had the same thing in common - Leg Extensions and Leg Curls back to back to failure then some compound movement as a finisher.

    So these were staples of my routines...

    Leg Extension to failure super setted with Lying Leg Curl to Failure super setted with Squats.

    Leg Extensions to failure super setted with Seated Leg Curl to failure super setted with Leg Press

    Leg Extensions to failure super setted with Seated Leg Curl to failure super setted with Smith Machine Front Squats

    Leg Extension to failure super setted with Lying Leg Curl to failure super setted with Hack Squats

    So you can take those 4 basic routines and really even mix it up more by changing the reps and the weight.

    For all these routines, I'd do 3-4 sets. If I was going higher reps (15-20 per exercise) and lighter weight, I did 3 sets of the cycle. If I was going lower reps (10 reps per exercise) and heavier weight I did 4 sets of the cycle.

    Taking it up another notch, sometimes, I do drop sets on the Leg Externsions and Leg Curls while super setting the compound movement after that.

    So something like this...

    Leg extensions 250 X failure >> 180 X failure >> 100 X failure super setted with Leg Curl 250 X failure >> 170 X failure >> 90 X Failure super setted with Smith Machine Front Squats 225 X failure.

    Hope that gives you some ideas!

  19. #19
    Senior Moderator NbleSavage's Avatar
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    Re: The Cashout Leg Training Thread...

    That's the ticket, Cashout. Huge props for being willing to share! Good show, Mate!

    I tried a bit of the pre-exhaust technique during my leg session this morning. Bit of the leg extensions to failure super-set with squats for 10 reps. Did four cycles of this. HUGE quad pump! I had to work-in the leg curls after the fact (I train at home and have to alter the setup to go from extensions to curls) but I also included 4 sets of 10 reps on the leg press & then hit calves.

    Best leg workout I've had in a long time.

    Going to use this and may incorporate it 2x per week.

    Cheers, Cash!

  20. #20
    Senior Moderator NbleSavage's Avatar
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    Re: The Cashout Leg Training Thread...

    Adding my petition to this thread for a Cash Chest Training Thread

    Do it, Mate. DOOOOOOOO EEEEEEEEEEEEET.

    /Ahnold

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