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  1. #1
    Elite transcend2007's Avatar
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    Long or Short Ester

    I getting ready for my next cycle.

    I am going to run 300mg test, 300mg nandrolone, 300mg mast. My question is what advantage is there in running NPP and Mast P (short esters) over deca and Mast E (long esters). I have been taking Mast P with my trt and love it.

    However on cycle it seems like I could reduce the injections (and injection volume) by 50% by using the long esters.

    If I go 100 mg route of test prop, NPP, Mast P that's inject M/W/F 3 shots of 3 ML (total of 9 ML's per week).

    If I go the 200 mg route of test e, deca, Mast E thats 2 shots per week 4.5 total ML's of injection volume.

    I've been on trt for 3 years so I use to the needle.

    Are there any advantages to the short esters?

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    Elite #TheMatrix's Avatar
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    Re: Long or Short Ester

    short esters work quicker so effects can be felt quicker. long esters are sometimes prefered for less frequent injections but bloods will be up n down most of the cycle.

    short esters are sometimes used to maintain stable bloods or more in the users control.

    pob will say stable bloods are overrated.


    I prefer what ever im looking for in that cycle.
    most times long esters are dosed higher then short esters.

    if the user is vulnerable to sides from a specific compound. he should consider a short ester in case sides get bad, he can abandon ship

  3. #3
    Elite PillarofBalance's Avatar
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    Re: Long or Short Ester

    Stable bloods are over rated.

    The advantage of going with NPP over deca is recovery time. Even if you don't PCT and go to TRT there is a period coming of deca where you just aren't right. It's shorter with NPP.
    "Overzealous dosing" -Jin

    Rest in Peace Robot Lord. First round of Natty Boh is on me when I make it up there with you brother.

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    Elite Hero Swole's Avatar
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    Re: Long or Short Ester

    For you current cycle. Its not worth it imo. Just stick to long esters.

    First of all 3cc 3 days a week its going to give you hella pip. Second, injecting short esters 3x a week is not optimal for short esters (its debatable). Optimum would be ed or oed. Third, its just going to be a pain in the ass and i mean it.

    Unless due to logistic you gotta manipulate your cycle to a greater extent. Save your self the trouble.

    Short ester means that your testosterone lvls peak quicker.
    If you want quicker results you can always frontload for the first week. And reach the desired t level quicker by injecting more of it before they peak naturally. But this is my preference.
    Team Losieloos

  5. #5
    Elite transcend2007's Avatar
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    Re: Long or Short Ester

    How would you guys compare legit Primo e (250/mg) to any of the Nan's......I will admit I suffered a little pip and pussied out a little. I have 10 vials sitting here.....but its hard to imagine 20 weeks of pip like that?

    Before the pip attackers even start, yes my estrogen is in check (so don't even go there). And, I don't wear dresses....lol

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    Senior Member Braw16's Avatar
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    Re: Long or Short Ester

    I agree with POB on the npp. If I'm not going to get ready for a show I would run long esters. For me test e and some of the long esters tend to cause me to bloat. Plus I get tired of pinning.

  7. #7
    Elite ken Sass's Avatar
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    Re: Long or Short Ester

    you get more of the compound with short ester, less ester means more room you have for the active chemical. hits quicker and is out quicker

  8. #8
    Elite hulksmash's Avatar
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    Re: Long or Short Ester

    Originally Posted by transcend2007 View Post
    I getting ready for my next cycle.

    I am going to run 300mg test, 300mg nandrolone, 300mg mast. My question is what advantage is there in running NPP and Mast P (short esters) over deca and Mast E (long esters). I have been taking Mast P with my trt and love it.

    However on cycle it seems like I could reduce the injections (and injection volume) by 50% by using the long esters.

    If I go 100 mg route of test prop, NPP, Mast P that's inject M/W/F 3 shots of 3 ML (total of 9 ML's per week).

    If I go the 200 mg route of test e, deca, Mast E thats 2 shots per week 4.5 total ML's of injection volume.

    I've been on trt for 3 years so I use to the needle.

    Are there any advantages to the short esters?
    There are NO advantages to a short ester

    ONLY IF YOU COMPETE will short esters be better, due to closer contest time and dropping long esters of test and deca and others from the offseason

    Don't compete=use long esters

    I NEVER use short esters

  9. #9
    Elite hulksmash's Avatar
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    Re: Long or Short Ester

    Originally Posted by PillarofBalance View Post
    Stable bloods are over rated.

    The advantage of going with NPP over deca is recovery time. Even if you don't PCT and go to TRT there is a period coming of deca where you just aren't right. It's shorter with NPP.
    It's not overrated, it's bullshit!

    Hell, even endogenous testosterone and other hormones are NOT stable! Placebo at its finest

    And yea-for those of you who cycle on and off, a shorter NPP would fare better then deca

    If you don't come off stick to deca

  10. #10
    Elite. SFGiants's Avatar
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    Re: Long or Short Ester

    I like short over long with Mast, and Nandrolone pinning it M/W/F it's more bang for your buck and a quicker start, I like fast shorter cycles that I can stop and restart up faster with.

    To say there is no advantage is wrong the biggest advantage is more frequents faster cycles apposed to a long one.

    Shit happens and when a cycle gets cut short because of something out of your control at least with the short ester you got more out of it if you needed to stop the cycle. I know this for fact I was on a cycle when each of my surgeries came up with 2 of 3 unexpected.

    IMO why chose pinning 2 x a week over 3 x a week if your going to get going quicker and if needed to come off you can with less waste.

    It's a preference one must make a choice on and for me short = better but I always stay on Test C.

    Then there is even the bigger decision and that is the source with choosing the gear that suits you the best and in some cases it is a choice made of one over the other just so you know you got what you need and already know how it responds to your body. I have seen people make poor choices on prices or ester's to come up short with not such good gear so I always say what I was taught and that is stick with what has been already proven to you because it's you body and wallet.
    Knock Em Down and Keep Em Down!

  11. #11
    Palestinean Prophet Yaya's Avatar
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    Re: Long or Short Ester

    I love shorts...but also like longer ones as well
    There's nothing like a slice of tiller to get your day started -PFM

    Dizz - you're white. Please dont say nigga - DieYoungStrong

    DONALD TRUMP 2016

  12. #12
    Elite. SFGiants's Avatar
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    Re: Long or Short Ester

    Originally Posted by Yaya View Post
    I love shorts...but also like longer ones as well
    Yaya takes the long and short one he is not picky at all, says size don't matter!
    Knock Em Down and Keep Em Down!

  13. #13
    Elite DF's Avatar
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    Re: Long or Short Ester

    Originally Posted by transcend2007 View Post
    How would you guys compare legit Primo e (250/mg) to any of the Nan's......I will admit I suffered a little pip and pussied out a little. I have 10 vials sitting here.....but its hard to imagine 20 weeks of pip like that?

    Before the pip attackers even start, yes my estrogen is in check (so don't even go there). And, I don't wear dresses....lol
    You have to cut it with something brother. Primo 250 hurts like a mofo. Inject it with mast or test or even a lower mg Primo.

  14. #14
    Elite transcend2007's Avatar
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    Re: Long or Short Ester

    True that DF!

    I am leaning towards the shorter ester npp currently due to faster kick in and as others have said faster out of my system.

    What do you guys think of 375mg test c 250mg/ml, 300mg npp 100mg/ml, 300mg mast p 100mg/ml per week M/W/F for a 12 to 16 week cycle?

    Originally Posted by Dfeaton View Post
    You have to cut it with something brother. Primo 250 hurts like a mofo. Inject it with mast or test or even a lower mg Primo.

  15. #15
    Senior Member CCCP's Avatar
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    Re: Long or Short Ester

    if you do props(short esters) i would recommend doing it ED instead of EOD to keep levels balanced, which means lower your dosages. 300-400 mast is more than enough, about 75 a day, thats just my opinion from my research

  16. #16
    Elite Popeye's Avatar
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    Re: Long or Short Ester

    I love short esters...complete different experience for me...Im on E this cycle and it aint shit to the Prop ive done before or the TPP....ill never run long ester again...o and prop EOD for me

  17. #17
    Elite. SFGiants's Avatar
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    Re: Long or Short Ester

    Originally Posted by Popeye View Post
    I love short esters...complete different experience for me...Im on E this cycle and it aint shit to the Prop ive done before or the TPP....ill never run long ester again...o and prop EOD for me
    Short ester = more bang
    Knock Em Down and Keep Em Down!

  18. #18
    Elite Bullseye Forever's Avatar
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    Re: Long or Short Ester

    Originally Posted by SFGiants View Post
    Short ester = more bang
    I agree with SFG,Ive ran Deca along time and this cycle I just started using npp for the first time,and I will never go back to deca,cause it fits me better,health wise,and working quicker,and I get less water bloat with npp than I did with deca.when I run out of masteron e,i will get me some masteron prop to use,im using a test/npp/masteron trip right now,fixing to drop the npp and add var to the mix,cant wait.....oh and transend,you will love npp!!

  19. #19
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    Re: Long or Short Ester

    In the case of DECA v NPP they deliver nearly the same amount of nandrolone once the ester is cleaved. So they are, for all practical purposes, equipotent on a mg/mg basis.

    Milligrams below are the estimated amount of active hormone per 100mg of hormone and ester.

    Boldenone base: 100mg
    Boldenone acetate: 83mg
    Boldenone Propionate : 80mg
    Boldenone Cypionate : 69mg
    Boldenone Undecylenate: 61mg

    Clostebol Base: 100mg
    Clostebol Acetate: 84mg
    Clostebol Enanthate : 72mg

    Drostanolone Base: 100mg
    Drostanolone Propionate: 80mg
    Drostanolone Enanthate: 71mg

    Methenolone Base: 100mg
    Methenolone Acetate: 82mg
    Methenolone Enanthate: 71mg

    Nandrolone Base: 100mg
    Nandrolone Cypionate: 69mg
    Nandrolone Phenylpropionate: 63mg
    Nandrolone Decanoate: 62mg
    Nandrolone Undecylenate: 60mg
    Nandrolone Laurate: 56mg

    Stenbolone Base: 100mg
    Stenbolone Acetate: 84mg

    Testosterone Base: 100mg
    Testosterone Acetate: 83mg
    Testosterone Propionate : 80mg
    Testosterone Isocaproate: 72mg
    Testosterone Enanthate : 70mg
    Testosterone Cypionate : 69mg
    Testosterone Phenylpropionate: 66mg
    Testosterone Decanoate: 62mg
    Testosterone Undecanoate: 61mg

    Trenbolone Base: 100mg
    Trenbolone Acetate: 83mg
    Trenbolone Enanthate: 68mg
    Trenbolone Hexahydrobenzyl Carbonate: 65mg*
    Trenbolone cyclohexylmethylcarbonate: 65mg*

    Drug Active half-life

    Anadrol / Anapolan50 (oxymetholone) 8 to 9 hours
    Anavar (oxandrolone) 9 hours
    Dianabol (methandrostenolone , methandienone) 4.5 to 6 hours
    Methyltestosterone 4 days
    Winstrol (stanozolol ) 9 hours

    INJECTABLE STEROIDS

    Drug Active half-life

    Deca -durabolin (Nandrolone decanate) 15 days
    Equipoise 14 days
    Finaject (trenbolone acetate) 3 days
    Primobolan (methenolone enanthate) 10.5 days
    Sustanon or Omnadren 15 to 18 days
    Testosterone Cypionate 12 days
    Testosterone Enanthate 10.5 days
    Testosterone Propionate 4.5 days
    Testosterone Suspension 1 day
    Winstrol (stanozolol) 1 day


    STEROID ESTERS

    Drug Active half-life

    Formate 1.5 days
    Acetate 3 days
    Propionate 4.5 days
    Phenylpropionate 4.5 days
    Butyrate 6 days
    Valerate 7.5 days
    Hexanoate 9 days
    Caproate 9 days
    Isocaproate 9 days
    Heptanoate 10.5 days
    Enanthate 10.5 days
    Octanoate 12 days
    Cypionate 12 days
    Nonanoate 13.5 days
    Decanoate 15 days
    Undecanoate 16.5 days

    ANCILLARIES

    Drug Active half-life

    Arimidex 3 days
    Clenbuterol 1.5 days
    Clomid 5 days
    Cytadren 6 hours
    Ephedrine 6 hours
    T3 10 hours

  20. #20
    Elite. SFGiants's Avatar
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    Re: Long or Short Ester

    I go by what my body tells me from experience not a chart or study.
    Knock Em Down and Keep Em Down!

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