Dropped Test P for C and now HR is elevated during exercise

[Nick]

Hey guys, I was running Test P 400mg/w and Primo 200mg/w for 12 weeks and it was great. I really didn't want to come off cycle this time so decided to drop Test P and Primo and start test C and just cruise. I do hybrid-style training, run in the am lift heavy later on. During my "easy runs" to keep my HR 145bpm or below I was running at a 8:20 mile pace and my HR wouldn't even touch 150's unless it was a long run day and I was at like mile 12.

Ever since switching to test C, my HR gets to 150 by mile 3 and I'm running at like a 9:20 pace now trying to keep it low. What could be the reasoning behind that? I get my bloods done monthly but haven't yet since switching to test C. I didn't think it would make a big difference, I can't even think of what could be causing this issue. I'm hydrated, my BP is fine, I don't feel like im over training. I'm a little lost since it happened so suddenly. Has anyone experienced something like this before?

(I also didn't just drop test P and go right into C i slowly incorporated test C while lowering test P dosage)

 

[CJ]

Could be accumulated fatigue.

 

[Thrawn]

I just read the title, and throwing blindfolded. perhaps more water retention causing higher blood pressure causing increased heart rate.
Now I read post, is your blood pressure fine while you're working out or when you have a chance to sit down and relax. So essentially the question is timing of when you check your blood pressure.

 

[GreatGunz]

No need to taper either

 

[Send0]

Hey guys, I was running Test P 400mg/w and Primo 200mg/w for 12 weeks and it was great. I really didn't want to come off cycle this time so decided to drop Test P and Primo and start test C and just cruise. I do hybrid-style training, run in the am lift heavy later on. During my "easy runs" to keep my HR 145bpm or below I was running at a 8:20 mile pace and my HR wouldn't even touch 150's unless it was a long run day and I was at like mile 12.

Ever since switching to test C, my HR gets to 150 by mile 3 and I'm running at like a 9:20 pace now trying to keep it low. What could be the reasoning behind that? I get my bloods done monthly but haven't yet since switching to test C. I didn't think it would make a big difference, I can't even think of what could be causing this issue. I'm hydrated, my BP is fine, I don't feel like im over training. I'm a little lost since it happened so suddenly. Has anyone experienced something like this before?

(I also didn't just drop test P and go right into C i slowly incorporated test C while lowering test P dosage)

The ester used for the steroid has no impact to your heart rate. Zero, zilch, none.

 

[Thrawn]

The ester used for the steroid has no impact to your heart rate. Zero, zilch, none.

Directly agree, but esters do influence water retention and estrogen. That water retention and estrogen can influence heart rate and blood pressure. No universal dose dependant outcome but it is a Risk factor to consider.

 

[Yano]

Directly agree, but esters do influence water retention and estrogen. That water retention and estrogen can influence heart rate and blood pressure. No universal dose dependant outcome but it is a Risk factor to consider.

I did not know this about esters .. thanks man now i got some new shit to read up on.

 

[Send0]

Directly agree, but esters do influence water retention and estrogen.

Can you post the source you used that shows that esters have a DIRECT influence on water retention and estrogen?

I can explain why this isn't exactly true, but I want to make sure I haven't ignored any study that you're using that might prove otherwise.

 

[snake]

Going in a different direction and I'm probably wrong, but have you done anything to alter your blood pressure?

Blood pressure medication or anything that affects your blood pressure will have an inverse reaction on your pulse rate. If you can't create enough pressure under stress, your heart has to compensate by pump more often.

 

[Thrawn]

Can you post the source you used that shows that esters have a DIRECT influence on water retention and estrogen?

I can explain why this isn't exactly true, but I want to make sure I haven't ignored any study that you're using that might prove otherwise.

Sure, give me a couple hours now it won't specifically say Ester it's talking about the amount of free and total test that will convert to estrogen and estradol which will then cause water retention. And since Esther's build up The available amount of available testosterone at certain times that could amaratorize is greater.
Here's a quick graph propionate versus cyp same dose same and frequency.

 

[Thrawn]

The shitty part is though everybody is different on how their body reacts.
Perhaps me stating Esther was too broad or vague since it was only a part of the equation. I was trying to keep it simplistic

 

[Send0]

Sure, give me a couple hours now it won't specifically say Ester it's talking about the amount of free and total test that will convert to estrogen and estradol which will then cause water retention. And since Esther's build up The available amount of available testosterone at certain times that could amaratorize is greater.
Here's a quick graph propionate versus cyp same dose same and frequency. View attachment 53205

So tell me, what would happen if you took a cypionate or enanthate ester, and injected smaller doses ED or EOD.... vs much larger doses once or twice per week

FYI; I actually know exactly how this works, and why people THINK short esters are the reason for lower estrogen levels .. but I'm trying to lead you to a logical conclusion.

Hint; it's still not the ester.

 

[Thrawn]

So tell me, what would happen if you took a cypionate or enanthate ester, and injected smaller doses ED or EOD.... vs much larger doses once or twice per week

FYI; I'm trying to lead you to a logical conclusion.

You would have much more stable /levels with much less peaks and valleys

 

[Send0]

You would have much more stable /levels with much less peaks and valleys

Your estrogen would be lower, comparable to short esters. The only difference; like you eluded to, is that you won't have a massive drop off.

People get higher estrogen from long esters because they are taking large bolus shots. Inject ED or EOD and the peak levels will be no worse than short esters; and will actually be lower than the short ester version in SOME individuals. It's not because the ester itself inherently creates more estrogen. It's because of the amount of hormone injected in one go.

For the rare minority of people who have aromatization issues even short esters, they are sometimes recommended to move to a long ester and ED injection frequency for this reason.

With that said, I'm still interested in the study you used as reference. There's probably something else in there I'd find interesting beyond the aromatization topic.

 

[Thrawn]

Your estrogen would be lower, comparable to short esters. The only difference; like you eluded to, is that you won't have a massive drop off.

People get higher estrogen from long esters because they are taking large bolus shots. Inject ED or EOD and the peak levels will be no worse than short esters; and will actually be lower than the short ester version in some individuals. It's not because the ester itself inherently creates more estrogen. It's because of the amount of hormone injected in one go.

For the rare minority of people who have aromatization issues even short esters are sometimes recommended to move to a long ester and ED injection frequency for this reason.

I think my better wording should have been how the Esther is used lol not which ester is used

 

[Send0]

I think my better wording should have been how the Esther is used lol not which ester is used

Yeah, that definitely would have been a better way to word it. It's definitely how people commonly use long esters.

Thanks for going back and forth with me on this. You have no idea how many people would fly off the handle and would feel like they were being attacked, when really all I wanted was to understand what the other person really meant. I really appreciate it man.

Still send that study if you ever find it; there's always something useful I can get from studies I'm not familiar with. Post either here or in a PM to me would be fine.

 

[Thrawn]

Yeah, that definitely would have been a better way to word it. It's definitely how people commonly use long esters.

Thanks for going back and forth with me on this. You have no idea how many people would fly off the handle and would feel like they were being attacked, when really all I wanted was to understand what the other person really meant. I really appreciate it man.

Still send that study if you ever find it; there's always something useful I can get from studies I'm not familiar with. Post either here or in a PM to me would be fine.

It was my pleasure I love going back and forth respectfully. no matter what I always learn something.