Feedback on first cycle

[MrRippedZilla]

What's with all you guys saying no dbol? What's the big deal?

And since all cycles should include testosterone it would make sense to run test alone for a first cycle so you can understand your reaction to testosterone. In future cycles you will then be able to discern sides from test from sides caused by additional compounds.

And that is why I agree with Seek & disagree with the sticky recommending the addition of Dbol

At the mid-cycle point you want to see how you react to test, ideally via bloodwork, not only to manage the rest of the cycle effectively but also to use as information in the future when planning additional cycles. The addition of dbol is going to make it very difficult to get an accurate portrait of things - especially when it comes to estrogen control.

Also, your going to get great results on test only for your first cycle anyway so why overcomplicate things? Have a nice run, witness the good and the bad, then add another compound in if you wish the next time round.

 

[Seeker]

As Zilla stated. In addition Test is to me the safest compound one can use, i mean we do produce it naturally ourselves. We're just introducing more of it into our bodies for enhancement purposes. IF you react badly to test as your 1st cycle, chances are pretty high you won't do very well with other compounds either. Especially dbol.

 

[automatondan]

Briefly. I'm a big believer in starting small and always leaving room for advancement and improvement. Personally, if I had to do it all over again I wouldn't have taken test until I stopped seeing results from more mild AAS such as Anavar, Winstrol, the Primobolan, or Deca. This way you afford yourself the opportunity to see how you body reacts to AAS before you introduce the heavy androgens such as test. That being said, both of the AAS you mention above are powerful with test being the alpha. I would consider the Dbol by itself starting at:20mg daily for weeks 1 & 2
25mg daily for weeks 3 & 4
30mg daily for weeks 5 & 6
I know this may not be a "flashy" first cycle but it shouldn't be. It's entry level an should give you good gains while leaving plenty of room for progression. I would consider adding your nolvadex starting week 3. This cycle should also minimize your PCT effort as it is short and shouldn't negatively affect your HPTA nearly as much as what you listed above. I would start my HCG (2000iu every 5 days) on the last week of the cycle and for an additional 2 weeks after. Clomid only needs to be taken for about 2weeks starting at 100mg on the last day of your cycle and reducing to 50mg a week after that. I'm not sure why you were planning to start your clomid 4weeks after your above cycle ended but I would advise against that. Early on it doesn't take much to grow and hopefully this cycle will result in quality gains and end as a positive experience giving you a good idea as to how your body responds to AAS. Not to mention you still have some testE left on the shelf to look forward to for later.

Apparently you believe in starting "small" as you put it, but I guess you dont feel the same when it comes to liver damage and aromatization as well as having adequate amounts of testosterone in your system... I dont know where you got pretty much ALL of your information, but most of what you are saying is not only wrong, but irresponsible and dangerous. Please stop trying to advise people about AAS steroid use until you move on from "this is just my opinion" to learning and sharing facts.... There are plenty of fact/science based threads on this forum as well as published papers available, perhaps start there. But please dont continue recommending things you know very little about, its just not wise, and you could get someone hurt.

 

[deejeff442]

Holy **** I can't believe what I read. Amazing some dumb ****s give advice.
Test is stronger then other compounds. That's his opinion lol. Easy research says different. Can't believe this guy's hasn't been torn a new ass from his post.
Especially the dbol only 1st cycle.

 

[Nitro]

Holy **** I can't believe what I read. Amazing some dumb ****s give advice.
Test is stronger then other compounds. That's his opinion lol. Easy research says different. Can't believe this guy's hasn't been torn a new ass from his post.
Especially the dbol only 1st cycle.

Fair enough. I'll make sure I do more reading and less posting. I would just like to say I did not feel it was irresponsible to recommend a small/moderately dosed oral for a first cycle. Especially with an anti estrogen and a responsible PCT. Dbol would not be my first choice but it was what he had available and is not nearly as androgenic as test possibly avoiding some of the sides associated with heavy androgens. Also, being an oral he would be able to avoid any possible injection complications being that he is a beginner. My advice came from Chemical Muscle Enhancement by L Rea who emphasized testosterone is not for novices. A direct quote from a renowned expert in the field. It's not like I'm just giving reckless opinions. Please accept my apologies.

 

[Gofalcons]

That's pretty much entirely contrary to how first cycles should be ran. All cycles should have testosterone as the base compound. Without using testosterone other compounds will shut you down, leaving you with no circulating testosterone. That's no way to go through life. And since all cycles should include testosterone it would make sense to run test alone for a first cycle so you can understand your reaction to testosterone. In future cycles you will then be able to discern sides from test from sides caused by additional compounds.

Thank you for emphasizing this I see a lot of guys at the gym(especially new guys) who don't understand this their scared of needles all they want to do is take orals IMO this can't be preached enough!!

 

[MrRippedZilla]

My advice came from Chemical Muscle Enhancement by L Rea who emphasized testosterone is not for novices. A direct quote from a renowned expert in the field. It's not like I'm just giving reckless opinions. Please accept my apologies.

L Rea is NOT a "renowned expert" in this field.
In fact he is responsible for quite a bit of the misinformation surrounding DNP when he decided to write a book citing a bunch of research he hadn't read, interpreted or applied correctly. This lead to readers of his bullshit book receiving poor/potentially harmful advice from this so called "expert".

This is also why I don't want people bashing YOU; they should be bashing the source of the information. In this case, the "reckless opinion" of L Rea

 

[Nitro]

L Rea is NOT a "renowned expert" in this field.
In fact he is responsible for quite a bit of the bullshit surrounding DNP when he decided to write a book citing a bunch of studies he hadn't read/skimmed the abstract, leading to a bunch of misinterprete data = bullshit book with incorrect advice.

This is also why I don't want people bashing YOU; they should be bashing the source of the information. In this case, the "reckless opinion" of L Rea

Thanks bro. Again, I apologize for any misinformation and I will be more responsible in my posting going forward. It's been awhile since I've had good information available to me and it seems I may have been misled. Nevertheless, it was not my intentions to give bad advice or especially to put somebody in danger. Please forgive me.

 

[ToolSteel]

Should be fine yeah
..


What's with all you guys saying no dbol? What's the big deal?

Personally I advise against is because learning to dial in my e2 was bad enough with test only. Only after really getting the hang of it was I able to add dbol with no issues a year later.

 

[automatondan]

Thanks bro. Again, I apologize for any misinformation and I will be more responsible in my posting going forward. It's been awhile since I've had good information available to me and it seems I may have been misled. Nevertheless, it was not my intentions to give bad advice or especially to put somebody in danger. Please forgive me.

Its nothing personal man, we just see and hear a lot of garbage and have a ton of people come on here claiming misinformation as truth... I got upset because you said it was just your opinion and so I was upset that you were contradicting factual information. I did not know you actually got your information from someone you (and many others) believed to be an expert... that is why it is so important to fact-check the things we read... Especially when it comes to our health... Sorry if I jumped down your throat. Im just sick of people getting/spreading bad info and it having lead to sometimes irrevocable consequences....

 

[Chrome]

Thanks everyone for the comments, lots of useful info for me and I appreciate it. My cycle now looks like this, also I'm trying to figure out if I should run an AI during the cycle or only use it if any sides start to show up? Also for HCG do you prefer to use it during cycle or after the last injection of test up until pct.

Week 1-12 Test E 500mg a week
HCG 250 IU

PCT
Start pct 2 weeks after final injection for 4 weeks
Clomid 50/50/25/25
Nolva 40/40/20/20

 

[automatondan]

Thanks everyone for the comments, lots of useful info for me and I appreciate it. My cycle now looks like this, also I'm trying to figure out if I should run an AI during the cycle or only use it if any sides start to show up? Also for HCG do you prefer to use it during cycle or after the last injection of test up until pct.

Week 1-12 Test E 500mg a week
HCG 250 IU

PCTand see
Start pct 2 weeks after final injection for 4 weeks
Clomid 50/50/25/25
Nolva 40/40/20/20

ALWAYS have an AI on hand... personally, id like to at least take a minimal dosage and see if that works or if I will need to increase, but thats just me... Some guys like to wait until they notice sides before starting their AI... But as a beginner, I think it might be best to take a minimal dosage so your e2 doesnt get out of control before you notice and leave you panicked, hoping theres no lasting damage... As far a HcG goes, if you can afford to run it the whole cycle, do it, it will help with recovery, but if not, run it at the end and increase the dosage to 500 iu per week.